FFA league

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Homer23
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FFA league

Post by Homer23 » Wed Jun 14, 2006 5:40 pm

I have come up with a very cool idea.

FFA league

30 minute matches of killing whoever team has the most kills at the end wins!

Rules: No cheating

its ok for 15,20,30 matches

NO! i repeat NO!!!!!!! 5 minute matches.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Since i am un experienced i do not know how to make a league. I like someone to make it and make me an admin.



Cheers
Cheers

-H23-

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Post by MonsterMan++ » Thu Jun 15, 2006 10:01 am

Nice idea, some good map makers are Duchtrai, trepan, LouMan and many more. Try sending a PM to one of them
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Post by joevano » Thu Jun 15, 2006 12:14 pm

MonsterMan++ wrote:Nice idea, some good map makers are Duchtrai, trepan, LouMan and many more. Try sending a PM to one of them
Making maps has nothing to do with setting up a league, and technically nothing with running a server (although many map makers do have their own server).

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Post by The Red Baron » Thu Jun 15, 2006 4:03 pm

donny_baker wrote:
MonsterMan++ wrote:Nice idea, some good map makers are Duchtrai, trepan, LouMan and many more. Try sending a PM to one of them
Making maps has nothing to do with setting up a league, and technically nothing with running a server (although many map makers do have their own server).
I'd like to ask what you know about running a league? Depending on the league setup, a map can be very very crucial to a league. Especially to a FFA league... You seem to be offering alot of criticism, but it doesn't seem to be founded...

Homer: just because you cannot code, doesn't mean you can't set up a league, or a website. There are plenty of people out there with the talent, who might be persuaded, but I will tell you know, Its going to take alot more than just
Since i am un experienced i do not know how to make a league. I like someone to make it and make me an admin.
ALOT ALOT MORE than that. Make friends with some one who can code, share your ideas, expand you idea. You have a basic concept down, but it needs more. Basically, you need to become a salesman in order for this idea to become a reality. It takes alot of hard work and time, and good people skills.
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Post by joevano » Thu Jun 15, 2006 8:18 pm

The Red Baron wrote:I'd like to ask what you know about running a league? Depending on the league setup, a map can be very very crucial to a league. Especially to a FFA league... You seem to be offering alot of criticism, but it doesn't seem to be founded...
The guy asked for help on setting up a league, not for map makers. I agree that the map is a very important part of playing, but making a map has ZERO to do with setting up a league or a server. I am not being critical of the question, I was being critical of the answer. The guy asked for help setting up a leage and server, not for the names of map makers which gets him no closer to his goal. And the questioner obvioulsy doesn't have the expertise (based on the way he worded the question) to set up what he is asking for and your suggestion is a good one. Louman, trepan and Duchttai don't really need a message from someone trying to set up a league/server that is what these boards are here to do. If they want to help out they will read the boards.

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Post by The Red Baron » Thu Jun 15, 2006 10:30 pm

I think you still fail to see, that with FFA, a well made map is quite critical. Making a map actually can have a lot to do with setting up a league, and everything to do with setting up a server. You can't run a server without a map.

Homer asked a huge wide open-ended question. If he plans on making a FFA league, and I think he should chase this idea for its merit - http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=8245 Then a map will play a crucial and critical role in the league.

You can't just get anyone, or throw up any map. Lost in today's mapmaking, is the idea of flag balance. People are creating maps, at random almost it seems, and there has arisen a need for shot limits, because of gross camping, and certain flags absolutely ruining the gameplay.

and a map maker would be critical to his league, if he has no map-making skills whatsoever.

Unless you can do everything yourself, or you are setting up a ducati league, which is 2 shots, no jumping, rico, and no superflags, only team flags. You're going to need a map. If you want something new, you're going to need a new map, IF you can't make a map, you're going to need a map maker.
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Post by joevano » Fri Jun 16, 2006 12:48 am

donny_baker wrote:I agree that the map is a very important part of playing, but making a map has ZERO to do with setting up a league or a server.
OK. This is my last post on this thread. I did say that a map was very important, but without the infrastructure the map is nothing. If he cannot get the infrastruture he needs (server, bandwidth, and web hosting), a map does him no good. Don't put the cart before the horse.

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Post by The Red Baron » Fri Jun 16, 2006 4:39 am

donny_baker wrote:
donny_baker wrote:I agree that the map is a very important part of playing, but making a map has ZERO to do with setting up a league or a server.
OK. This is my last post on this thread. I did say that a map was very important, but without the infrastructure the map is nothing. If he cannot get the infrastruture he needs (server, bandwidth, and web hosting), a map does him no good. Don't put the cart before the horse.

Familiar with the Gu League?
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Post by joevano » Fri Jun 16, 2006 8:32 am

OK. You got me interested. Yes, I know of the GU League (and many of the players), but do not participate...

(Sorry I lied about it being my last post on this thread :wink: )

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Post by The Red Baron » Fri Jun 16, 2006 2:18 pm

donny_baker wrote:OK. You got me interested. Yes, I know of the GU League (and many of the players), but do not participate...

(Sorry I lied about it being my last post on this thread :wink: )
its a league based off a map and server. They had a map and server up, before they ever had a league.

You need to establish a map and playing style, before you can create a league.
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Post by joevano » Fri Jun 16, 2006 3:58 pm

OK. I agree with you on that point. But, there was no league decision until there was a successful map, or there was some but you had to find a good map. My guess is that it is the first one. And I agree that we are splitting hairs here (based on our perspectives of the problem)... But the infrastructure was in place to facilitate the league, before the league came into being. There was a host for the map, even before there was a league. And there was a server to host the map before the map was made. So the infrastructure should be attended to first. I doubt that the maps that the GU League uses are first revisions of any map someone made, before the league was discussed/dreamed up. And before they made the map they had a pretty good idea of where it would (or who would) be hosted or had the equipment/bandwidth and expertise available to themselves.


OK. Now back to the original post (and I guess back on topic ;) ):
Homer23 wrote:I have come up with a very cool idea.

FFA league

30 minute matches of killing whoever team has the most kills at the end wins!

Rules: No cheating

its ok for 15,20,30 matches

NO! i repeat NO!!!!!!! 5 minute matches.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Since i am un experienced i do not know how to make a league. I like someone to make it and make me an admin.

Cheers
It would appear that from the statement (this really isn't a question) that he has been reading the Ducati League discussions and made some recommendations (based on the discussions) and claiming them to be his own. Also from his post he has no desire to create the league, he is asking someone else to do it and just let him be an admin. Anyone can have an idea, but implementing it is where the rubber meets the road. There is nothing in that post that says he has even the tiniest desire to learn how to do it. It is similar to me saying, "Hey you won the lottery. I have an idea that you build cars and then you should give them to me, because it was my 'idea'."

This now brings us back to your original suggestion to him, which is rock solid (at which point I really leave this discussion, and I mean it this time, maybe) :
The Red Baron wrote:Homer: just because you cannot code, doesn't mean you can't set up a league, or a website. There are plenty of people out there with the talent, who might be persuaded, but I will tell you know, Its going to take alot more than just ALOT ALOT MORE than that. Make friends with some one who can code, share your ideas, expand you idea. You have a basic concept down, but it needs more. Basically, you need to become a salesman in order for this idea to become a reality. It takes alot of hard work and time, and good people skills.
And a cold PM to someone, similar to "I need a map because I want to start a league" (of course probably not quite so blunt) is no way to make freinds and influence people. And will most likely get you nowhere closer to the goal.

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Post by goblin » Fri Jun 16, 2006 7:28 pm

donny_baker wrote:There is nothing in that post that says he has even the tiniest desire to learn how to do it.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but nothing in the post says that he will refrain from learning how to do it during the proces either...
donny_baker wrote: It is similar to me saying, "Hey you won the lottery. I have an idea that you build cars and then you should give them to me, because it was my 'idea'."
IMHO not similar. Being an admin is work, and not necessarily fun work all the time. It's also a duty that takes time, time that cannot be spent on other things. And it involves taking responsibilty, and people who take responsibility also take a verbal beating from time to time - sometimes even because they deserve it.
Now I could be wrong about the above, since I don't exactly know what tasks and duties a BZ server admin has.

I could also be wrong about the feeling I get, that you are trying to make Homer look like one who just want's a free ride, letting everybody else carrying the heavy load. Homer is my team leader and spends time training me, so I know he's not like that, since it must feel like frustrating work :wink: .

I think you all should appreciate Homers will to spent some time on non-gaming tasks. Making leagues work by doing admin-work and sharing ideas keeps the game alive.

If Homer asks too big a favor, then why not just tell him? I see no reason at all for shoving dark motives into his shoes like this.
Tank you!

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Post by CapN » Fri Jun 16, 2006 10:21 pm

It's somewhat funny to me that this is getting that much discussion. I guess i'm not the only one who procrastinates by reading to the forum. I just think Homer did not choose his words for his sentence very well. It is so hard to "read" into people's real intentions...all we have are the words written down. His sentence was pretty blunt given what he was asking for.

Seems to me all TRB was doing was trying to be helpful and honest.

Not to go back track again on the GU thing but....I do think someone did just create that map....looking for just something different for CTF.


I'm pretty sure it was one of the first maps with raised bases?? Soooo....I dont think the maker had any other intentions but to make a cool map, with some new features that came about with a new release.

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Post by Homer23 » Mon Jul 10, 2006 10:55 pm

Eh, This is Comlicated, Should i make it or not, does anyone know how to make a league?? :slick:
Cheers

-H23-

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Post by EnderWiggin » Wed Aug 30, 2006 5:14 pm

I don't know how to make a league, but if you make it i'll probobly be the first (or close to it) to sign up. FFA needs a league, and it would be awsome if it was made.

Ender

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Post by ducatiwannabe » Wed Aug 30, 2006 5:45 pm

Stop the discussion about maps. :) The Red Baron's right. A map is VERY important.

Now, as for the league, sounds great, Feathers! There are quite a few coders around here. :) Find one and they'd probably be willing to help you. Sorry I can't help you there 8)

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Post by joevano » Wed Aug 30, 2006 6:07 pm

It had been stopped for 2 months.. until it was dredged up again...

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Post by joevano » Wed Aug 30, 2006 6:09 pm

It had been stopped for 2 months.. until it was dredged up again...

My point was not that a map wasn't important at some point in the league process... but that with out a server for the league to live having a map will not get you a league...

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