New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

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New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by alfa1 » Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:07 pm

The idea is adding dynamically some specific contents (not unlimited ones) to one's motto for several in-game functionalities; mostly aimed for LU. Every new entry by the command needs the player to rejoin to take effect. All motto additions are deleted for players, and not for observers, when a match is started and players' scores are reset; for everybody, if a server is re-started. After a logout, they keep in memory for 2 minutes and return to screen after joining again.
*IMPORTANT*: scores also should be kept in memory for 2 minutes.

Hope it is useful. Suggestions are welcome. (If it is a plug-in: developer needed; I can't still.)

Note: treated before somewhat; poll API was enhanced. I think nowadays, though, that method, maybe, is too complicated for these simple functions (Mapchange Poll Suggestion).

General info: this enhancement/plugin would be used to:
  • Vote for both/either fun and/or official matches, including, optionally, their time limits.
  • Vote for map changes, giving as much options as enabled maps are.
  • Tell when one goes AFK and, optionally, for how long.
  • Tell when one is hurried (to start a match, in example).
  • Optional: vote for any other situation offering: "yes", "no" and "dkref" (don't know/refusal) options.
Command arguments by examples (square brackets = optional value):
  1. Matches:
    /dynmotto fm [15]
    result:
    alpha1 (Team's Name) (FM [15])

    /dynmotto offi [20]
    result:
    alpha1 (Team's Name) (FM [15]) (offi [20])

    /dynmotto fm [15]
    result:
    alpha1 (Team's Name) (offi [20])

  2. Maps:
    /dynmotto hix
    result:
    alpha1 (Team's Name) (HIX)

    /dynmotto miniduc
    result:
    alpha1 (Team's Name) (Mini Duc)

    *Here map is changed by someone to Mini Ducati* (all additions are deleted).

    /dynmotto newmap
    result:
    alpha1 (Team's Name) (new map)

  3. Other cases:
    • AFK
      /dynmotto afk [5]
      result:
      alpha1 (Team's Name) (AFK [5])

      /dynmotto afk [10]
      result:
      alpha1 (Team's Name) (AFK [10])
      .
    • Someone is hurried:
      /dynmotto fm [30]!
      result:
      alpha1 (Team's Name) (FM [30]!)
  4. Optional feature: to vote for other polls/situations (commas = options):
    /dynmotto yes,no,dkref
    result:
    alpha1 (Team's Name) (yes,no,DK-REF)
Last edited by alfa1 on Thu Apr 20, 2017 11:43 pm, edited 12 times in total.

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by blast » Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:14 pm

Since you can't change the motto without a rejoin, that makes this pretty useless.
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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by alfa1 » Thu Apr 20, 2017 11:57 pm

A practical example: you join a LU HIX server with 8 players already on it: 4 shooting and 4 observing. Some can be AFK, then you can notice it quickly. But you notice that 3 players have "fm" on their mottoes; since you also want to play, you just say "I can fm" and done: you get your FM quickly too.

Lots of times decisions take lot of time to be made.

I also thought that the need to rejoin would be fixed/improved in the future since mottoes are being used, for some time now, for different and somewhat dynamical objetives from the original one (team's names, ELOes, automatic mottoes, etc.).

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by alfa1 » Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:39 am

An ideal would be modifying mottoes really dynamically (without rejoining). Since it is not possible nowadays, in the meantime, a possible workaround would be allowing real mottoes to be added together with teams' names; also much easier to develop. If you have a team, your real motto should be separated from its name with "|"; if not, your motto should show double brackets (to keep people from faking real teams' names when they don't have one or simply to show you don't have one):

"alpha1 (Team's Name | Real motto)";

"alpha1 ((Real motto))".

In case you didn't have a team or a real motto, the situation would be the same as nowadays: not showing anything:

"alpha1".

Then, there would be 2 options:
(1) Allowing people to use their real mottoes together with teams' names (easy to develop).
(2) Allowing it but only for the specific situations described in the first post (not so easy; it would be a C/C++ "switch case").

I repeat it to be clear: all these, until the real dynamic command is available, would be made without the command but using the real motto option into the menu (with the need of rejoining, OFC), as a workaround.

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by kierra » Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:09 am

No offense....I fail to see the need for all this "functionality" It is incredibly redundant to what we have now and imnsho a waste of a dev's time that could be used in real improvements.
What happened to the simpicity of typing "fm anyone?" or "2 in?"
It doesn't take rocket science to figure if no response, then they are either afk or not interested and too lazy to say so.
polls in motto? again, type in the game, much simpler and dynamic!

I DO NOT want my elo in the motto....period and neither do several others.
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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by alfa1 » Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:56 pm

Oh I just see the "workaround" was already added on the Issues section for LeagueOverseer about 2 years ago, thanks that allejo told me. Well, then, I hope it is developed some day, as well as dynamic mottoes (if, of course, at the end, they are understood as useful enhancements).

kierra wrote:I DO NOT want my elo in the motto....period and neither do several others.
That was just a mention of one of the examples of people using mottoes for several objetives (different from the original one); in this case, Constitution's servers ELOes.

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by alfa1 » Mon Apr 24, 2017 9:14 pm

2 new arguments:

A. Matches:
  • Waiting for a mate to 2 in:
    /dynMotto 2in
    result:
    alpha1 (Team's Name) (2 in)
    .
  • Taking a break:
    /dynMotto resting [10]
    result:
    alpha1 (Team's Name) (resting [10])
Last edited by alfa1 on Mon Apr 24, 2017 9:37 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by kierra » Mon Apr 24, 2017 9:28 pm

What you did today on LU match server amounted to spamming...constantly rejoining to change your motto...."2in", "i can play 2in", "resting". ALL done during matches on allejo 5196 and was incredibly distracting to those of us playing!

It is a simple concept to say : "2in" in obs for those there to see and is respectful behavior to those playing!
"Trying to reason with a fool is like trying to teach a goldfish to bring you the newspaper"
"Sometimes people try to expose what's wrong with you, because they can't handle what's right about you."
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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by kierra » Tue Apr 25, 2017 12:05 am

kierra wrote: ...constantly rejoining to change your motto...."2in", "i can play 2in", "resting".
I do correct my statement above about 'motto'. Was with changing your nick that the rejoins were done.

Still disruptive to the players on the field.
"Trying to reason with a fool is like trying to teach a goldfish to bring you the newspaper"
"Sometimes people try to expose what's wrong with you, because they can't handle what's right about you."
"Measure your words -- they determine the distance of your relationships"

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by alfa1 » Tue Apr 25, 2017 5:37 pm

2 positive feedbacks:
  • A League Council's member:
    01.png
    (45.36 KiB) Not downloaded yet
  • A known and experienced player (I have not picture or log; 2017-04-24 17:00 approx. (local time)):
    02.jpg
    (370.57 KiB) Not downloaded yet
    click click boom: I am resting too
    click click boom: I wish I could change my motto like that
    (Note: this name change was not into a match as kierra said; I clarify that I stopped testing dynMotto idea after she warned me *once*; however, I don't consider it was as "constant" and serious as she complained about; in the other hand, I realized later that name changes (with an added message) are more distracting, or distracting, than motto ones.)

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by Bertman » Tue Apr 25, 2017 6:07 pm

OK... before we go too far with this, when i said "nothing wrong with that", it was in the context of the discussion we were having about me being against ELOs in mottos, after my understanding this wasn't about that... In this post, it is taken out of context and is in no way my showing approval for such plugin. Sorry for the confusion.

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by alfa1 » Tue Apr 25, 2017 6:28 pm

Bertman, it was not as an "aproval", let's say, (also, there is a difference between the requested feature/plugin and the requested real motto becoming available again (workaround)); it was as you not being *in opposition* to the idea/s ("nothing wrong"). Which I consider positive. Doesn't mean you "voted" in favour in any "poll", let's say; just you (seemed to me, at least) are not in opposition.

Also, it is different from "ELOes in mottoes" topic, as I understand.

I (and surely *lots* of others) always have seen *lot* of people (including myself) which use "afk" as motto sometimes (between other useful messages (or just simple thougths)).

I want to add that, just in case, I am an active player and I have played for several years now.
Last edited by alfa1 on Tue Apr 25, 2017 8:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by Bertman » Tue Apr 25, 2017 6:48 pm

I am just saying you have taken something I said out of context and made it look like my positive response to your idea....

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by Orange Peanut » Tue Apr 25, 2017 8:00 pm

I do not see a need for a dynmotto for any of the examples you have stated above. If people want to fm, they ask who wants to fm. If people are afk or don't want to play, they will not respond or say they don't want to. Timelimit for fm is usually asked before the fm starts and is set based on the needs of the players. If people are taking a break and want people to know they are going to be back soon, they will say that. I see no need to put any of that in your motto when you can just type it in chat. That being said, I don't have a problem with keeping our normal motto after the team name, there would just have to be a clear distinction between what is a team name and what is a motto.

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by alfa1 » Tue Apr 25, 2017 8:02 pm

Bertman, I interpret it as a non-opposition; as my idea seeming not bad for you. What other interpretation could it have? Is it "out of context"? If so, in which way?
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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by JeffM » Tue Apr 25, 2017 8:27 pm

You have documented the positive feedback, where is your documentation on the negative feedback? Only posting the positive will give an unjust bias.

Also, what problem are you trying to solve?

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by quantum dot » Tue Apr 25, 2017 11:27 pm

Alpha1, maybe I am wrong, sorry if this is the case, but reading the latests threads that you started recently it seems to me that you are posting PMs, private chats, screenshots, etc from private conversations with players and admins with no permission whatsoever from them. It is a rule of courtesy to ask those involved in those conversations if you can re-post. You are risking not getting answered by anyone if you continue to make public things that were said privately.
Don't let school interfere with your education.
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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by alfa1 » Wed Apr 26, 2017 8:46 pm

Recently an fm took about 10 minutes to start. There were approx. 14 people there.

The workaround (*1) is rather easy to be developed. Please, League Council, consider accepting it. If the trouble of some rejoinings *while a match is being played* is too much, then a new rule could be written: "You can use your motto to vote (link to this topic), but only when there are not running matches".

Score Restorer plug-in would be needed to be used, because if people are shooting and they want to change their motto to vote/write something they should keep their scores on.
I recommend to implement a command like '/scorereset' to be used when necessary too; in the meantime, it would be good to set the time to just 7 seconds (*2).

---
(*1) viewtopic.php?f=114&t=19492&p=173574#p173480 ;
viewtopic.php?f=114&t=19492&p=173574#p173496 .

(*2) I remember that I reported a bug (in IRC) about when the scores were reset the Kills column kept unmodified. Also, IIRC, other bug would be that players are spawned on base, only if they are alive (v. 2.4.6, IIRC).

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by macsforme » Wed Apr 26, 2017 11:25 pm

What you are proposing is less functional and more complex than what we already have. If people want to communicate and arrange FMs, they can use chat for that. Using your motto is not a fundamental form of communication in this game.

Also, we have a bug tracker on GitHub... please report bugs there so they don't get lost. It is usually not sufficient to mention a bug on IRC or the forums, as no formal tracking is done on it.

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by alfa1 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 2:08 am

Can it just be possible that mottoes come back again like it was before (keeping the teams' names part, OFC) and can it just be possible letting people use them freely like it was before? (I ask the League Council, again, because it is the right way.)

Thanks for the participation. I am not the best English writter/reader; I think I gave all the needed explanations, though; tell me, please, otherwise. I also don't want to make it too long.

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by alfa1 » Thu Apr 27, 2017 7:47 pm

Just 2 more concepts/comparisons to add:

This "dynMotto/real motto" idea would/could be like these real life situations, worldwide used:
  • Raising hands (and keeping them up for a certain time) for polls: used at any society's level, even at the highest ones (government). They don't use voice; nobody write down voices (our chat log) because it is slow and too complicated; they use this visual, easy, simple and permanent, in a short period of time, method.
  • Signs: used, also, at any society's level: from advertisements to public (political) manifestations, passing through airports signs saying "I am looking for this person". They are permanent, in some way, too; they, again, don't use voice, non-stop, to say the message. They are, also, used in every/almost all chat system/s (IRC), either with names or with a bit more complex system, for a long time now ("away" state, in example).
I am not talking about 3 people trying to get an FM happening (which by using "voice"/chat would be enough); I am talking of 14 people trying to do it or, also, when you have to wait for 10 or 20 minutes because either nobody say anything, there are lots of AFK people, there are lots of chatting people, there are lots of shooting people or you are just hurried, in example. Instead of waiting for 10 or 20 minutes (while you can get tired in the meantime), you could just get your FM/offi in 2 or 3.

Mottoes do not replace chat; both complement each other. Chat is the first way of communication, I agree; mottoes are the second one. People do use mottoes to say something nowadays already, in every server. Just we, in few of them, have lost this option somewhat recently/lately.

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by JeffM » Thu Apr 27, 2017 10:19 pm

Sounds like you are trying to implement a very crappy version of lobbies/friends lists using motto, something it is ill sited for. A website or third party app would do a better job than in game mottos. The protocol doesn't support changing them dynamically, so all of this is moot. Since the idea would require development time to implement, that time wold be better spent implementing in game lobbies and friends lists.

The problem you are trying to solve may be real, but your idea for solving it is not good, let it go.

Also no bugs are ever reported on IRC, only bug reports on GitHub are accepted. IRC is just a place where people talk. If you talk about a bug on IRC you are not reporting it, you are taking about it. Since you refuse to create a GitHub account, you are not capable of reporting any bugs.

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by alfa1 » Fri Apr 28, 2017 6:46 am

I correct myself: the FM decision I told about was between 10-14 people approx. and took *more than 20 minutes* to finish.

JeffM: if I understood well, this has not to do, necessarely, with BZ development because I didn't ask for it as a requirement.

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Re: New functionality/plug-in request: dynMotto

Post by click click boom » Fri Apr 28, 2017 12:06 pm

I don't think it's a terrible idea but not exactly 100% useful. I compare his idea to Aim aol instant messenger, on the messenger one could set a status like "brb, eating, etc" I think it could serve a small purpose..

Anyways right now the email string is strictly clan use, why not have clan use and personal use like prior? Keep the clan name first so incase someone has there GUI settings for the email length lowered they can still see what clan they belong to....

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