Blurry Tanks on a TFT Screen

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Thonolan
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Blurry Tanks on a TFT Screen

Post by Thonolan » Thu May 17, 2007 7:23 pm

Hi,
my old CRT monitor crashed and so i get a Tft monitor. Games like WoW , Tremulous and AA work perfectly but BZ is near unplayable for me . If I moved on the battlefield the buildings and tanks look very blurry for me . At firts i thought its the reaction time of 22ms from my Tft. But after a talk with jh` he told he had the same effect with an newer Tft who had reaction time of 5 ms .
Anybody has the same problem or somebody has an solution ?

Here my system : AMD XP 3000
Nvidia 6600 GT (MSI)
OS:Linux Feisty Fawn (kubuntu)
Monitor: Eizo FlexScan L685

Thanks for tips :)

Best regards Thonolan

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Post by jh^ » Thu May 17, 2007 7:44 pm

hmm i have same card as you do, nvidia6600, could this problem have something to do with nvidia?yes, weird thing is games that are supposed to be lot "heavier" than bz work well with me too, for example battlefield2 and wolfenstein enemy territory.

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Post by JeffM » Thu May 17, 2007 11:29 pm

make sure your set to the native res of the display. Unlike a CRT a lcd/flat pannel can't scale it's pixels ( they are actual things in the display, not just how fast a beam scans). If you run a non native res, the display has to interpolate, and that can look very bad.
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Re: Blurry Tanks on a TFT Screen

Post by LethalMix » Wed Jun 06, 2007 7:53 am

My 24" Dell widescreen came in today, and it's stellar. EXCEPT on bzflag -- it's so blurry (when I rotate) I can hardly play. I have an 8800GTS running at native 1920x1200, so that's not a problem. Why does bzflag suck on LCDs? My old CRT is great for bzflag, but I'm not keeping it around just for that :-)

LethalMix
Thonolan wrote:Hi,
my old CRT monitor crashed and so i get a Tft monitor. Games like WoW , Tremulous and AA work perfectly but BZ is near unplayable for me . If I moved on the battlefield the buildings and tanks look very blurry for me . At firts i thought its the reaction time of 22ms from my Tft. But after a talk with jh` he told he had the same effect with an newer Tft who had reaction time of 5 ms .
Anybody has the same problem or somebody has an solution ?

Here my system : AMD XP 3000
Nvidia 6600 GT (MSI)
OS:Linux Feisty Fawn (kubuntu)
Monitor: Eizo FlexScan L685

Thanks for tips :)

Best regards Thonolan

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Post by The Red Baron » Thu Jun 07, 2007 8:34 pm

LethalMix

What OS choice are you running?

And second thought: is BZ not optimized for "wide screen"? or is that relegated to driver/card control?
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Post by LethalMix » Fri Jun 08, 2007 12:23 am

The Red Baron wrote:LethalMix

What OS choice are you running?

And second thought: is BZ not optimized for "wide screen"? or is that relegated to driver/card control?
Hi Baron,

I'm running WinXP Pro. BZ behaves the same on wide or square screen. My friend has a Samsung 19", and he sees exactly the same blurry effect. In any case, it does have widescreen modes on the resolution list.

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Post by jh^ » Fri Jun 08, 2007 6:20 am

well i think this problem is something to look into(maybe devs would know more about whats causing this?), since many players seem to have these problems with lcd. by the way lethalmix what's your monitors response time? mine has 5ms so it should not be problem here. hmm, lethalmix too uses nvidia card, again im wondering if nvidia has something to do with this problem.

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Post by LethalMix » Fri Jun 08, 2007 6:47 pm

jh^ wrote:well i think this problem is something to look into(maybe devs would know more about whats causing this?), since many players seem to have these problems with lcd. by the way lethalmix what's your monitors response time? mine has 5ms so it should not be problem here. hmm, lethalmix too uses nvidia card, again im wondering if nvidia has something to do with this problem.
Hi jh,

My monitor's response is:
Response time: 6 ms typical (gray to gray), 16 ms typical (black to white).

I kind of doubt the graphics card has anything to do with it, because it was completely fine on the CRT I just replaced. Games like Counter-Strike, Madden07 look phenomenal on the new LCD.

Though, I did notice on Madden last night that, when the whole scene spins around (e.g,. after kickoffs), there is some blurring. That might be typical of LCDs.

What LCD do you have, and how does BZflag look on it compared to a CRT? I'd be really surprised if there wasn't at least some streaking when you rotate.

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Post by The Red Baron » Sat Jun 09, 2007 1:11 am

hrm.

I don't see any blurring on my 17" 5ms, and 22ms monitors. I've tested a ATI 800xt and Nvidia 7800 GTX. Win2k and WinXP 64.

Now my 17" LCD's are SXGA 1280 x 1024 resolution.
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Post by jh^ » Sat Jun 09, 2007 8:00 am

well i have samsung syncmaster 940 mw, response time 8ms. its both tv and monitor though. well i have to say crt compared to this lcd is way better playing bz....picture is really sharp no matter how i move. its odd how it works for some people(like trb) yet some people seem to have problems, i hope its not some setting im missing. i doubt 8ms response time is too slow...at least other games work fine.

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Post by The Red Baron » Sat Jun 09, 2007 2:50 pm

Jh^ I wonder if its your wide screen resolution. Have you tried using different resolutions?

8ms response time, is not too slow. Its not the response time. I'm suspecting wide screen. Its no OS specific. You and thono use linux varients, lethalmix uses Windows XP. I've used xp and win2k, no problems.

The only thing is, I'm not using widescreen. Perhaps thats it? Bz isn't "optimized" for wide screen. But I could be in deep left field with that theory.
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Post by jh^ » Sat Jun 09, 2007 5:39 pm

erm...im using windows xp and i tried diff. resolutions with vga cable with no success...but i might try again soon. how can you not use wide screen then with lcds? i think the native resolution is 1440x900 in mine.

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Post by joevano » Sat Jun 09, 2007 7:38 pm

Hmmm, a VGA cable... could that be the issue. Could it be DVI vs VGA cable?

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Post by A Meteorite » Sat Jun 09, 2007 7:45 pm

Using VGA for many LCDs will cause the screen to appear blurry. It's best to use DVI so there is no analog/digital conversions going on.

I use my native resolution (1440x900) on my 17" widescreen iMac, and everything is crystal clear.
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Post by TD-Linux » Sat Jun 09, 2007 8:17 pm

jh^ wrote:erm...im using windows xp and i tried diff. resolutions with vga cable with no success...but i might try again soon. how can you not use wide screen then with lcds? i think the native resolution is 1440x900 in mine.
Yeah, that's the first thing I was going to ask - if you were using a VGA cable.
VGA cables have major ghosting issues, and the higher the resolution, the worse they are.

My guess is that you are running other games at a low resolution, and BZFlag is running by default at your highest resolution, thus why BZFlag looks much worse.

The solution is simple - use a DVI cable instead. Both your videocards have DVI, and a LCD that size should, too. If your LCD didn't come with a DVI cable (it should have), then buy one on newegg.

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Post by The Red Baron » Sat Jun 09, 2007 11:16 pm

Hrm...

Shouldn't be cable issue.

I have a samsung syncmaster with DVI and VGA - No blurryness in either mode.
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Post by A Meteorite » Sun Jun 10, 2007 12:00 am

The Red Baron wrote:Shouldn't be cable issue.
This is common when LCDs are connected via VGA.
The Red Baron wrote:I have a samsung syncmaster with DVI and VGA - No blurryness in either mode.
Some LCDs cope better than others, but I've always noticed DVI to have better quality to some degree than VGA.
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Post by jh^ » Sun Jun 10, 2007 1:49 am

i said i tried with vga also....also with dvi. i agree with trb its not a cable issue.

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Post by A Meteorite » Sun Jun 10, 2007 1:58 am

jh^ wrote:i said i tried with vga also....also with dvi. i agree with trb its not a cable issue.
You didn't tell us you already tried with DVI. ;)
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Post by JeffM » Sun Jun 10, 2007 4:35 am

if you run the displays native res ( IN BZ, not your desktop ), and it's still "blurry" or more accurately "shears" when you turn or move. there are 2 possible causes, none of them are cable or card related.

1) try turning on "VSYNC" or "Sync to Vertical Blank" in your video driver. This can help if the problem is your display is drawing a frame in the middle of an update.

2) you have a crappy slow LCD display. They they exist. Yes they are VERY common. Check the "refresh time" or "response time" for the display. If it's high ( over 12-16 ) then you probably have a cheap display. They don't' work so well for games. Try lowering your frame rate using the frame rate limiter ( power saver ) to something that your display can handle..
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Post by jh^ » Sun Jun 10, 2007 11:48 am

how do i do that in windows? lower my framerate that is.

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Post by CannonBallGuy » Sun Jun 10, 2007 1:24 pm

jh: Use the Energy Saver option in the BZ Options.
When you turn that on your FPS for the game will be limited to 30 FPS.
This value can be changed by editing the following line in your config.cfg file:

Code: Select all

set fpsLimit 30
or by running this command in-game:

Code: Select all

/localset fpsLimit 30
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Post by LethalMix » Mon Jun 11, 2007 7:27 am

JeffM wrote:if you run the displays native res ( IN BZ, not your desktop ), and it's still "blurry" or more accurately "shears" when you turn or move. there are 2 possible causes, none of them are cable or card related.

1) try turning on "VSYNC" or "Sync to Vertical Blank" in your video driver. This can help if the problem is your display is drawing a frame in the middle of an update.

2) you have a crappy slow LCD display. They they exist. Yes they are VERY common. Check the "refresh time" or "response time" for the display. If it's high ( over 12-16 ) then you probably have a cheap display. They don't' work so well for games. Try lowering your frame rate using the frame rate limiter ( power saver ) to something that your display can handle..
I tried both your suggestions, but to no avail. Forcing VSYNC on doesn't help. And my monitor is well within your suggested response time range (6ms g-to-g). The other thing that strikes me as odd is that something like Counterstrike, in all its 1920x1200 glory, looks positively stellar. My bzflagging days (well, nights actually) might be waning :-(

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Post by The Red Baron » Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:24 pm

what resolutions are you using in bz?

you can find that info under the in-game options / display options
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Post by LethalMix » Tue Jun 12, 2007 7:19 am

The Red Baron wrote:what resolutions are you using in bz?

you can find that info under the in-game options / display options
1920x1200, 32-bit.

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