improving lag on a network ~ help

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improving lag on a network ~ help

Post by The Red Baron » Thu Aug 28, 2003 4:48 pm

Perhaps some of you know, There are two Barons. We often play on the same servers, Or try.

However, we always have a high lag when we are on the same server. Or Baron2, can kill people, and I cannot. Yet people can still kill me. I have cable coming into a router, and our computers connect into the router. What do you advise?

COnfused?????

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Post by Spaceman Spiff » Thu Aug 28, 2003 5:06 pm

I haven't the foggiest about what's going on... but I will tell you that this is a somewhat common problem. I talked to some guys (when I was looking for a broadband provider) that had the exact same trouble with other online games. I think it was something to do with IP assignment?

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Post by The Red Baron » Thu Aug 28, 2003 5:10 pm

okay this is the setup.

Cable comes into modem. service is provided via network with a router as Firewall. Cable modems hooks up to router via network line, Not USB. 3 computers hook into router. Any advice for decreasing lag when on the same servers. WE have no problem when on different servers, It is when we sign on to the same server that lag, and NR happens.
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Post by Grumbler » Thu Aug 28, 2003 5:24 pm

I can not offer any real advice, But i can confirm that I have the same problem. It seems to occur right away, but it always happens within 10-15 minutes. I always wondered if the router/server get confused because you are sending/recieving data to the same location, same port, and in real time.

If anyone can offer advice on this, I would also be interested.
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Post by Grumbler » Thu Aug 28, 2003 5:26 pm

found this on google:
I think a feature called 'NAT trigger tags' is required for multiple LAN PC's to use the same inbound ports simultaneously behind a NAT box.

I think you're on top of what I was originally looking for - where the outbound trigger's IP destination allows that IP (and only that IP) to forward back. This way, only attempting the same server would conflict.
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Post by The Red Baron » Thu Aug 28, 2003 5:35 pm

and what is 'NAT trigger tags'??

I don't quite understand your last post.
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Post by Grumbler » Thu Aug 28, 2003 5:47 pm

neither do i, but that was a dicussion in "some" forum about a similar problem. They indicated that the issue has to do with the firewalls.

sorry, thats where my info drops out
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Post by JeffM » Fri Aug 29, 2003 2:15 am

what make is the router, I have heard these problems but only with linksys routers, as they suck in a most complete and total way.

And also moving this topic to help where it belongs.
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Post by Chestal » Fri Aug 29, 2003 12:42 pm

Some UDP protocols have problems with people behind NAT. The bzflag protocol has been enhaced to get more NAT friendly. With 1.7g2 there usually shouldn onl ybe problems when two people who are behind the same NAT join at about the same time. When one player joins first, then drives around, it should be safe for the other to join. The problem is the handshake / guessing that is done to be able to assign UDP packets to players.

If I remember correctly, 1.9 implemens a real handshake now (or at least we plan to do it) so it should be able to cope with all situations.

If the server is confused about the mapping of ports to player slots, strange things can happen. One of these things is that lagstats show weird values or lots of lost packets.

If you just encounter somewhat higher lagstat values, though, then it seems to be a different problem.

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Post by The Red Baron » Sun Aug 31, 2003 1:44 am

You are no help Jeff. I have a linksys router. Bummer. What router do you suggest?

Chestal. You described exatly what happens. Lag is not that bad. It is lost packets.
Chestal wrote:With 1.7g2 there usually should be only problems when two people who are behind the same NAT join at about the same time. When one players joins first, then drives around, it should be safe for the other to join
tried that. Sometimes it works, sometimes is doesn't.
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Post by Spaceman Spiff » Sun Aug 31, 2003 6:02 am

May I reccomend a Gigafast router? They're really cheap and run very nicely. :)

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Post by The Red Baron » Sun Aug 31, 2003 1:07 pm

I have no current problems with my Linksys. Unless it has something to do with playing bzflag.

Chestal,

Now that you mention the NAT with 1.7g2. I remember that we didn't have issues with the "handshake" with 1.7e6 or earlier. Has the code drastically changed sense then?
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Post by Chestal » Sun Aug 31, 2003 3:37 pm

There have been some major changes with respect to the internal player id andthe reconnect port. I don't remember all of the details, though.

So, does the problem persist even when player A joins first, drives around, then player B joins?

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Post by JeffM » Sun Aug 31, 2003 4:35 pm

I have heard some people get better results if they update there firmware. The UDP NAT features of the linksys nat is flawed. I have had several people confirm this.
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Post by julesthejackal » Sun Aug 31, 2003 7:31 pm

Have you tried to upgrade the filmware to your router? I had the same problem on my LAN till I upgraded the filmware. Mine is an SMC router FYI. :?:

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Post by The Red Baron » Sun Aug 31, 2003 8:14 pm

yes chestal. PLayer A joins, drives around, PLayer B joins. PLayer A, suddenly notices slowing down of server, tanks NR, and He can't kill anybody.

As to upgrading Filmware. What is it, and what is this NAT feature? Explain a little please.

Patlabor, for future reference, what do you router do you recommend?
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Post by JeffM » Sun Aug 31, 2003 11:37 pm

I use a "gigafast" router, tho I have used D-link to much sucsess. The work well, and there HTTP config pages work on a every OS I've tried. and they are generaly cheaper then the linksys boxes.
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Post by The Red Baron » Mon Sep 01, 2003 1:57 pm

Do i want to perform this firmware upgrade??

http://www.linksys.com/download/firmware.asp?fwid=3
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Post by JeffM » Mon Sep 01, 2003 6:54 pm

an upgrade shoudl only fix bugs, and not add new ones, so I don't see why not.
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Post by The Red Baron » Tue Sep 02, 2003 1:19 pm

Well based on the description, it sounded like it would increase lag, not decrease it. I'll try it and see.

Also updated symptoms. Player A signs on and plays, Then Player B joins. Player A notices that tanks start to act laggy, ie, jumpy. Types lagstats and sees no problem. Meanwhile Player B has 1 of 2 problems. 1. He can either pick up flags, but cannot kill other tanks, tanks appear jumpy to him also. 2. He cannot pick up flags, and cannot kill other tanks. tanks still appear jumpy. Also, Player B is Not responding to Player A. However, Player B can see Player A just fine.

What does that suggest to you?
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Post by The Red Baron » Tue Sep 09, 2003 5:36 pm

Tried the firmware.

Does not help. Improves lag. but player A can kill tanks and PLayer B cannot. Player B can still be killed. I would appreciate help because my bro and I really like to play together and have been severely limited in playing.
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Post by JeffM » Tue Sep 09, 2003 6:04 pm

Sounds like the same problems nidhogger had with his linksys, he eventualy went to a dlink and all the problems went away.
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Post by Fiberchunks » Sat Sep 13, 2003 4:30 am

and I have had the same general problems with my linksys -- ditch it, and get a good router, imho.

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Post by The Red Baron » Mon Sep 15, 2003 12:26 am

darn.

new router= money

money=something I am pressed for.

also

new router= convince dad this one stinks. not a likely possibility.

shall continue as is.
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Post by JeffM » Mon Sep 15, 2003 2:27 am

step on old router
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