Voting

All things BZFlag - no [OT] here please
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Re: Voting

Post by tobylane » Fri Mar 20, 2009 10:08 pm

That beginners map idea is good, it should be easy to make a map with all sorts of simple obstacles, then some physics to allow bots in when they want. Imo it should be automatically chosen as the server first time, telling them first time they run bzflag.

Voting - Sounds like 3 fixes it, as solved as its going to get without individual backports.

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Re: Voting

Post by red-der » Fri Mar 20, 2009 11:12 pm

It would maybe enough to have a mention of this in the MOTD or a little link somewhere, so that [u]someone interested[/u] in it can find it easyly.

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Re: Voting

Post by gentle giant » Sun Mar 22, 2009 10:22 pm

The map should be relatively easy and should be mandatory when you start bzflag. It could encourage more people to get involved with the game. I wonder how fun it would be though. That would be the tough question.
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Re: Voting

Post by *Boinkage*! » Sun Mar 22, 2009 10:46 pm

How about we just say that if you abstain from the poll, you don't count?

A real voting system works like this: 10 people vote yes, 5 people vote no, 10 abstain. The final answer is "yes". 10 > 5

The voting system of bzflag works like this: 10 people vote yes, 5 people vote no, 10 abstain. The final answer is "no" 10 < 5+10

We need a system that finds which is higher: Yes or No. We don't need this: Yes or No+Abstain.
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Re: Voting

Post by gentle giant » Sun Mar 22, 2009 11:43 pm

I agree with you boinkage. We should get a system like you just said. The only problem is that it might be too powerful. So maybe we make a rule that makes at least 5-8 people have to vote for that rule to apply.
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Re: Voting

Post by red-der » Sun Mar 22, 2009 11:56 pm

Hmm,
there we are, back at base:

On a lot of maps, there are more like 3 or 4 players, not 5 to 8 players, if you dont take the top 5 maps.
On the "top maps", normally an admin is on it , too

So we need a working poll system on maps with 5 or less players.

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Re: Voting

Post by blast » Mon Mar 23, 2009 3:09 am

I don't think the voting algorithm needs changing. If you're on a server that needs that many polls, then maybe the server isn't run very well.

The real issue is the lack of a user interface for voting.
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Re: Voting

Post by Tank 52 » Mon Mar 23, 2009 6:44 pm

May i suggest the following which i personally think is easier then the current method of voting, type voteban to voteban someone or poll ban,then a list of all the players, basically being 1 is this player 2 is this player 3 is this player and so on,if it goes over 9 people then 9 would be for say a 2nd page and it would continue,the same for votekick. Then the option to vote yes would be y and no would be n,simple. But since it seems that 2.99 is using the same voting system, id suggest putting a bit of a thing in the middle of your screen,it could say thing's the server owner wants to say and of course how to vote,to get rid of it just hit the little OK on the bottom then boom your good.
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Re: Voting

Post by Knox » Tue Mar 24, 2009 7:07 pm

What about if the server owner/administrator promote more player to cops or give 'em at least the /kick permission. The chosen one should be active, fair and known. Someone could establish a IRC-Help-Channel. Well, i know, newcomers doesn't know about such things, but maybe a experienced player is present and can send for help.
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Re: Voting

Post by Bambino » Tue Mar 24, 2009 7:12 pm

Many players don't even know about IRC or how to connect. Also, having a well admin'ed server is key.
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Re: Voting

Post by Knox » Fri Mar 27, 2009 5:08 pm

Quiet Riot wrote:Many players don't even know about IRC...
dreamer wrote:Well, i know, newcomers doesn't know about such things, but maybe a experienced player is present and can send for help.
There won't be always a player to help. But it's better than doing nothing, eh? It's just that we should change something instead of discussing about "possibilities": What if, blah blah blah...! Did you expect we could solve it by discussing?
I would make a .pdf, but my English isn't "proper" enough. And i don't know enough about IRC to set up a channel.
Guess, it's up to the lovely admins out there! .D
Ok, now we found the problem, it's time to solve it.
At least trying would be nice! .D
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Re: Voting

Post by joevano » Fri Mar 27, 2009 10:01 pm

Well dreamer... even when there are experienced people out there helping people... they do not vote. You cannot fix someones apathy...
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Re: Voting

Post by gentle giant » Sat Mar 28, 2009 1:54 am

We cant fix everything, and admins wont always be around. So maybe when people register, they get a, "guide book", Of how two do a lot of stuff you can do when your registered. Including how to vote. Then if they still don't vote, I think we're screwed.
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Re: Voting

Post by Bambino » Sat Mar 28, 2009 2:48 am

Or just something that is in the "Account Activation" email.
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Re: Voting

Post by blast » Sat Mar 28, 2009 3:37 am

Or, ya know, just do what I said several times. Integrate the poll system into the client.... We can change the client...
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Re: Voting

Post by joevano » Sat Mar 28, 2009 9:18 am

blast wrote:We can change the client...
WHAT!!! How long has this been possible?!?!?!? :wink:
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Re: Voting

Post by Bambino » Sat Mar 28, 2009 9:23 am

joevano wrote:
blast wrote:We can change the client...
WHAT!!! How long has this been possible?!?!?!? :wink:
I believe it's a new feature. :wink:
Something like "y" for yes and oh, wait, that won't work.../y and /n?
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Re: Voting

Post by khazhyk » Sat Mar 28, 2009 2:07 pm

how about integrate it like other games, a dialog shows up, (out of the way) and says "press F1 to vote yes, F2 to vote no."

...like has been suggested before.

no need for / commands, that's what confuses new players.
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Re: Voting

Post by Knox » Sat Mar 28, 2009 2:40 pm

Positive Gravity wrote:Or just something that is in the "Account Activation" email.
Thats what i said. A .pdf in every activation mail.
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Re: Voting

Post by gentle giant » Sat Mar 28, 2009 2:40 pm

Yes, we can change the client to make it easier, or we can make the person who created the map change the % of the number of people to poll ban to 75% instead of 50%. So it would be easier to poll ban people.
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Re: Voting

Post by joevano » Sat Mar 28, 2009 3:40 pm

Making it 75% would make it harder.. not easier. if there are 8 registered players on 6 would have to vote yes instead of 4. But if you lower it then it is WIDE open for abuse... Server owners know what they are doing. We have been running servers for years and have learned where to set the %s so that they are fair and not abused. With low %s then a couple of people working together can wreak havoc on a server when the numbers of players are relatively low. Really the only option is not to play on servers with a poor admin team. Occasionally you will have problems when no admin is around on a well run server, but if it is a regular occurrence then maybe the server isn't worth playing on. Move on and play elsewhere...
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Re: Voting

Post by gentle giant » Sat Mar 28, 2009 3:48 pm

yes, that's what i meant joevano. It might not get abused though. What are the chances that someone team kills for the first time and people are going to ban him? There are good people in the Bz world, not than many bad people.
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Re: Voting

Post by joevano » Sat Mar 28, 2009 4:11 pm

Please read what I said...

Server owners have been running servers for years and have learned from experience. I agree, most people are good... but it only takes a few bad apples. And yes, by experience means that servers have lowered their %s and they have been abused. You have been around for a little over a month and may not have experienced any of the trolls yet... but that doesn't mean that they aren't there. We have seen them and know who they are.
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Re: Voting

Post by jinx » Fri Apr 03, 2009 4:01 am

Interesting discussion.

Yes, many players are apathetic when a voting poll appears. It takes a bit of work on the poll caller to make sure everyone knows *why* a poll is going to appear - this helps elicit more of a response. But, I do agree that *many* players just don't care enough to vote.

The sad thing is most players would probably vote if they knew (was paying attention) that a poll was going on. For that reason - I'd suggest a pop-up window alert upon a player dying if a poll is happening. Doing it then releases the player from getting killed while voting while they are "in the game" moment.

An option on the server side to force a player to vote before respawning back into the game would be even more effective - forcing players to learn *HOW* to vote before they can resume play. Yes, a radical idea - but it wouldn't take long for most all players to understand.

Just a thought. Discuss amongst yourselves.
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Re: Voting

Post by Knox » Fri Apr 03, 2009 6:24 pm

Just a few moment ago were a cheater on WNC. He killed us all by using SW when we spawned. I started a poll, the result was: 5 in favor; 0 against and 12 abstain.
For more details see pictures below...
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cheater2.png
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cheater1.png
(44.7 KiB) Downloaded 19 times
cheater.png
(43.16 KiB) Downloaded 19 times
What if you slept? And what if, in your sleep, you dreamed? And what if in your dream, you went to heaven and there plucked a strange and beautiful flower? And what if, when you awoke, you had the flower in your hand? Ah, what then? - Coleridge; English philosopher

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