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"Oops" in place of apology...

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 12:43 am
by Lan
I feel that it is rude to say "oops" or something similiar in place of an apology in response to a teamkill you made. While sometimes it can be deserved by the person you TKed if -they- caused the TK or did something similary stupid, but when you truly caused the teamkill, for example, if you hit the fire button by accident right behind a teammate, I feel it is reiterating that you caused the tk. In other words, saying "oops" rather than an apology is like saying, "I tked you because of my actions, deal with it, that's life." I feel that saying nothing is better because it isn't rubbing it in. After a brief argument about it on Hepcat, I am wondering what do you think? Is it rude to say "oops" without any apologies whatsoever in response to a teamkill that -you- caused (rather than that the other player caused it, like them having burrow and walking right into you on purpose), or is it equal to an apology? Is it better than saying nothing? Just curious.

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 2:15 am
by Memnarch
"oops" seems to me like te person is just trying to be annoying. It's like saying, "haha, I killed you, and I don't care if it was on purpose or not". Or maybe some people just say "oops" because they don't want to accept they did something wrong, or stupid. Anyway, "oops" is just snotty, and in most cases, I think just saying nohing is alright, but you should always appologize. I appologize, even if it's not my fault, and take the blame when I am tked, if it was my own fault.

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 2:29 am
by The Red Baron
hmmm You guys are really harsh.

I accept 'oops' as an apology, I give out 'oops' as an apology, but more often than not, I am silent. As I usually place my shots to avoid all Manner of tking. When such a circumstance does happen, usually it is the error on the other person's side, or a wild and random shot/spawn.

I find it rediculous the amount of un-intentional tking that happens. I could go on a spiel of the "good ol days" and when a tk happened one automatically assumed it was un-intentional and accidental.

I feel saying something in regard to a retarded action, ie, running some one over with your SR, or getting rolled over when YOu have burrow. requires an apology, or an 'oops' But I accept the fact that there are new players who do not always think through their shots and just knee-jerk react to an enemy coming at them. However, after repeat offenses (be they accidental) I rapidly lose patience and ask them to pay attention to where they are shooting, or Ask them to put me on hunt and avoid me.

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 8:31 am
by Pimpinella
I don't share your point Lan. With "oops" (unless used in a provocative way e.g. after an obviously not accidentaly tk) a the teamkiller shows that he didn't intended to kill me and it counts as an apology that way. I usually don't expect anybody to kill teammates willingly (sure, it happens...) so i can't expect a player saying "oops" to feel other than sorry for the tk.

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 9:19 am
by Guest
Memnarch wrote:...you should always appologize. I appologize, even if it's not my fault, and take the blame when I am tked, if it was my own fault.
I totally agree.

Face it. If you killed someone on you'r own team, one of you had to be at fault... Who cares if its an accident. An accident is where you trip and spill boiling hot tea in someones lap... You still aplogise.
You don't say "Ooops" and walk off, leaving them to clean up their lap.
And, if they stood up and accidentally knocked into you, then you would have hot tea down you and them and you would expect them to apologise. How would you fell if someone did that and said "Ooops" then just walked off...

If someone is TK'ed, someone has to be at fault and that person should apologise.
I apologise every time I TK unless it was on purpose for whatever reason (Cheater, repeated TKer, rejoiner, etc) even when it was clearly Their fault. If they are a kind person they will say back to me "np" or if it was their fault; "no. my bad. sry" which Is what I say if I get TKed but it was my own fault...

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 11:44 am
by Lirael_Goldenhand
Aye, apologising is a very good thing to do. It lets your other team members know that, yeah, you screwed up, but you won't do it again, otherwise there'll be a TKing war breaking out and everyone goes ballistic. So normally, I'll apologise with something like "Yikes, I'm a bit trigger happy this morning!" Or something like that. "Oops" is a perfectly fine way of apologising... it shows you've made a mistake and, if you're sincere about it, it doesn't come across as snotty.

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 11:57 am
by toaster
My tk rate is pretty low these days, and I seldom tk on purpose. (only when someone steals my flag)

I often say oops, or dang, because it's my first reaction. Half the time, the TKs are due to a situation with an ST, or a double ricochet. Oops comes out and I type it quickly, and it's cleaner than some of the things that come to mind, such as "Aw, Sh.."

I usually follow up with a sorry message immediately.

IMHO, lots of people send out "sorry" so much that I have to believe they've keymapped it. Some people tk so often and say "sorry" so much that I believe that they're not really sorry about it, they're just responding so they don't get kicked for tk. Those are the same people that respond or communicate very little, and as far as you know, they could be a smart bot with auto-sorry :)

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 12:43 pm
by I_Died_Once
Gee

You got some people that take TK's personal. Others get offensive about it. I've been tempted to keymap out something to the tune of

"I'm sorry but one of my bullets struck your tank, and we are on the same team! Please know and understand that I did not do it on purpose, and that I will do my best to refrain from doing it again in the future. I'm sorry that I might have foiled your plans with whatever flag you may have had. Please accept this heartfelt apology for my apparant lack of precision."

I guess it better than "Shut the (...) up, I didn't mean to!"

I think most people thats played the game for any real amount of time knows its par for the course, and doesn't feel a need to complain. Then again, there are others who love any opportunity to whine, moan, groan, and complain about any and EVERYthing they can.

Or, you could get kick and banned for "spamming" those excessive apologies. (Yes, thats happened)

My real suggestion is not to say the same thing every time it happens. "Oops" "My bad" "I sooo did not mean to do that" "Dude! You jumped right in front of my bullet!"

Much love and don't take it personal

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 4:25 pm
by Pimpinella
Yeah, it largely depends on the server.There are a lot where rarely anybody apologizes for anything. Actually Lan was takling about hepcat where you usually can expect an apology. It's a simple task, say sorry, prolly you even get a np in advanceand everything is fine (and hopefully you try to avoid further teamkills). However i also give an "oops" to show my teamie that it was unintended sometimes. This was never meant rude, and i was never accused of being rude doing so.

Pimpi

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 11:07 pm
by M1A2AbramsTank
Is this whole thing over someone saying "oops" instead of "sry"? I mean come on, half the time I TK is when some moron gets in the way of my shooting, OR 1 of my bullets ricos off something that i didn't suspect and hits someone. Really, u should be glad that they said anything to begin with!

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2005 11:20 pm
by baddmove
hmmm..well..i'm guilty of sayings OOOPS if i TK , just because it's quick and easy to type..sometimes i'll typye SRY if i think about it..BUT..i really am sorry.....besides..i hate that Donkey braying sound..LMAO!!!!

Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 4:21 am
by Dervish
I typically team msg "sry" when it was an obviously avoidable TK of mine where it's mostly my fault. If some teammate is clear across the map and they are too noobish to avoid a single shot of mine that might have gone astray, then I'm with Red Baron -- I don't say anything.

Same applies for noobs who run through you when you have SR, tailgate you when you have SW, or just move right into a combat between you and an enemy tank.

:P to all those noobs. :)

Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 4:25 am
by baddmove
"noobs" ah remember the day when iwas a "noob" driving along just thinking i would just kill someone and then WHAM..dead like a dork...ah the badd ole days...wait .i still get killed like that..hmmm

Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 10:03 am
by RexFlex
Dervish wrote:I typically team msg "sry" when it was an obviously avoidable TK of mine where it's mostly my fault. If some teammate is clear across the map and they are too noobish to avoid a single shot of mine that might have gone astray, then I'm with Red Baron -- I don't say anything.
I'm with you there. I've made my share of mistakes, but there are some people who just don't seem to make an effort to avoid friendly fire. I shoot at an enemy facing away from me, they jump away and a friendly walks straight into the line of fire. Result - both of us are dead and I'm down on my score. The only thing I'm sorry about there is that the noob took me with him.

Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 12:50 pm
by toaster
It gets kind of hard to avoid friendly fire sometimes. You're in a busy map, bullets flying everywhere, you dodge, double-tap a couple of shots, dodge, shoot again, jump to avoid a spray, and land on friendly fire. Happens all the time. Too many times a lot of people fire into the same space, and there is a limit to what the client can do.

It's also easy miss incoming shots on the radar if you're lining up a laser shot. And of course, radar's not much help at all if the shots coming your way are IB.

Some people just need to learn not to shoot where teammates are battling. I've saved a lot of teammies by picking off enemies around them. Sometimes you can't, and it's more important in the CTF role to spray for delay tactics while another teammie's capping the flag. If you die, and you take out a teammie, but you cap the flag, so what? Say sorry, press on, cap again. :)

"The most accurate incoming fire is friendly fire." - Murphy's Laws of Armed Conflict, #10

Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2005 10:01 pm
by Dervish
toaster, where'd you find the "Murphy Laws of Armed Conflict"? Those must be a riot. :)

Yeah, that also bugs me. Numerous times (we're talking in the numerous type of hundreds, if not more) some teammate follows me and shots to the side of me at an enemy that is in front of me. Are some players really that stupid? Don't they realize they're creating a bad situation? I guess they never dodge bullets on the ground, or they'd realize this is a bad situation.

*Sigh* I think I know what runs through their mind at that point, "See tank, kill tank, see friend, he's in way, shoot through him".

Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 12:40 am
by The Red Baron
Dervish wrote:toaster, where'd you find the "Murphy Laws of Armed Conflict"? Those must be a riot. :)

Yeah, that also bugs me. Numerous times (we're talking in the numerous type of hundreds, if not more) some teammate follows me and shots to the side of me at an enemy that is in front of me. Are some players really that stupid? Don't they realize they're creating a bad situation? I guess they never dodge bullets on the ground, or they'd realize this is a bad situation.

*Sigh* I think I know what runs through their mind at that point, "See tank, kill tank, see friend, he's in way, shoot through him".
90% of those situations are caused because the player doesn't not look at his radar. I only use radar, and hence I am able to avoid any and almost all Tk's.

Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 1:04 am
by Dervish
Yup, I too use mostly radar. The only time I use POV is when jumping to hit another tank in the air.

Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 4:38 pm
by torture2m
Looks like I might be guilty here... (esp. of being a nOOb.) I usually msg 'oops' if I turn into a teammates' fire or don't jump out of the way in time. I prefer to say 'sry' when I lose focus and shoot causing a tk.

Receiving 'oops', 'sry', 'dang', etc. is fine with me and preferred over silence.

Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 7:22 pm
by Dervish
torture2m wrote:Looks like I might be guilty here... (esp. of being a nOOb.)
Don't fret it, we were all newbies once. Although some might equate the two, there is a difference in my world of definitions between 'newbie' and 'noob'. The latter is a type of person that is perma-stuck in newbie mode (ie: too prideful to learn anything, or just too naive). :)

Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 7:27 pm
by Grumbler
this is why we emoticons in bzflag.


:doh: :cry: :oops:

:idea: :arrow: :arrow: :slick:

:lurk:

Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 7:36 pm
by DTRemenak
Grumbler wrote:this is why we emoticons in bzflag.
Error: sentence does not parse. Missing active participle.

Are you saying we _have_ them, or we _need_ them?

Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 8:09 pm
by Guest
DTRemenak wrote:Are you saying we _have_ them, or we _need_ them?
Error: sentence does not parse. Invalid character: "_"

Do you mean "we have them, or we need them?"?

Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 8:15 pm
by DTRemenak
Sounds like you need your parsing algorithms updated.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underscore

And maybe a review of netiquette:

http://www.amaryllis.co.uk/qas_netiqt.htm
Use underscores to underline or italicise a word or expression: “Follow these instructions _very carefully_ to avoid any further problems.”
Ultimately I use them because I'm lazy. _ is faster to type than

Posted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 9:17 pm
by Guest
DTR: I know. I was just messing.

Why does everyone take everything so seriously? Why must everyone nit-pick?
Who cares?
Surely we are all just muddling along throught this life... Why get in each other's way? :P