good player

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is this a good idea or not

Poll ended at Tue Nov 15, 2005 11:44 am

yes
7
19%
no
29
81%
 
Total votes: 36

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Post by Guest »

I can see why it could be a great idea, but still, WHO decides who is good enough for this server?
I consider myselt to have passed the n00b/newbie stage now since people like Mikk and Birdie acknowledge my existence (even if they think im an annoying, obnoxious little brat).
But I wouldn't say I am a vet. I have been playin 8 months, not 4 years like the real vets and I'm not in the same league as Mikk and Birdie...
But still, I do not delibertaly TK, I dont cap my own flag, I try to obey server rules...
Am I in?

It would be too difficult to make a split anywahere in all of BZ.
Whereveer you split there will always be some that didn't get in but feel they are as good as some others that got in...

It's impractical.
The only way I can think of doing it is to have a few servers not on the public list run by the real vets like Birdie, Mikk, etc who choose people on an individual basis as they like...
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Post by Burned Account -CNG- »

in dutchrai's tatics guide, there are some veteran moves, vets should be able to do these moves no sweat.

i think that all vets have good ratios, not scores, without camping
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Post by Soraya »

Carnage wrote:in dutchrai's tatics guide, there are some veteran moves, vets should be able to do these moves no sweat.
Where can i find dutchrai's tactics guide? i would like to read that.
CannonBallGuy wrote:I can see why it could be a great idea, but still, WHO decides who is good enough for this server?
He's right. I can't see a fair way to split the vets, or experienced players, from the noobs or newbies. Having private servers set up that are not on the public list, run by real vets like birdie and mikk, and having them pick who gets in is good to the point where they dont like someone. If one of them doesn't like a vet who's to say they wont let him in?
CannonBallGuy wrote:But I wouldn't say I am a vet. I have been playin 8 months, not 4 years like the real vets and I'm not in the same league as Mikk and Birdie...

I'm not sure if i'm a vet or not. I've been playing for maybe 2 or 3 yrs, but i'm nowhere near as good as some of these guys. I've only just recently discovered bz sites such as this one and the leagues. If this does happen, will i be invited into the private servers?
Carnage wrote:Soraya : now u know how it feels to be a vet .5 ;)
Carnage, does this mean you consider me a vet?
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Post by Burned Account -CNG- »

http://shellshock.bzflag.bz/guides-veteranstuff.html


vet .5
no ur only half of one ;)

anyways i think u would be consider as a vet if veterans consider u as a vet (if that makes sence)

like bird, i dont consider him as a vet, just a "skill"ful person
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Post by Guest »

Carnage:
I know and use all the rookie moves often.
I also know and use most of the veteran moves somewhat...

How much of a vet does that make me? :P
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Post by Soraya »

I know all the rookie moves and i kno most of the vet moves too... but seeing as i don't really play on flag and jump and rico servers, i don't use them that much... :D :P
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Post by The Red Baron »

the only move on that "vet list" that I would consider true "vet" Would be the the "Dutch bluff"

the other moves are easy to do, and learn. I would call them experienced moves, not vet moves.
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Post by Dervish »

To do them flawlessly would be a "vet move" in my opinion. It is easy to do the moves part way (read: experienced players, not vets), or do the moves but lack grace in performing them on a routine basis.
protected object myTank(){
foreach(noob in this.game){return frag(noob);}}
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Post by Guest »

So I'm not in then?
Then it really is a bad idea!
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Post by Dervish »

lol, cannonballguy. I'm sure some here would like to tag a "vet" by skill level. I tagged moves "vet" or not, but "vet" players in my opinion would be very different.

To me, vet players are people who are of adequate skill, but are active in the community and generally socially accepted as being a person you wouldn't mind playing a few rounds of one-on-one with on a server.
Dervish wrote:...the longer you've played BZFlag,... The more important a sense of community becomes
BZFlag skill is too varied, too wide, and too gray an area to measure with any accurancy. One way of abstractly measuring it might be to state, "you're a vet when you can admit you're good at BZFlag and people in the community know you". If you can't commit to that statement, you're either not a vet, or you're unbalanced (ie: community activity, but no game, or lots of game, but no community involvement).

I hope my explanation doesn't sound contradicting. :)
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Post by Guest »

That makes me a vet... :| :shock: ... :D
I am active in the community, Mikk, Birdie, carnage, QD, etc all know me (even if they do think i'm a juvenile delinquent). I also think I am getting pretty darn good at the game...
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Post by Burned Account -CNG- »

cbg, note i didnt want to become an experienced player that others called me a vet so that others would recognize me as one.

i became one cause i enjoyed ducati style and matches that allowed me excell in my experience as a player.

later in time, i was acknowledge as a vet.



so asking people tell u are a vet is like asking an to be a Gu admin, it will never happen ;)
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Post by Guest »

Carnage: I don't see how I asked ot be called a vet.
I was just joking.
The topic is about a server for Vets, I was questioning how anyone could decide who is a vet and who is not. This simply lead to others trying to dfine "Vet" and I simply said that I fitted Dervish's description of one...

I know I am nowhere near vet status. I am perfectly content playing for fun, and official matches, and improving every day.
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Post by RPG »

I play alot, but no "vets" see me cause I'm always at Secretplace. Don't believe I play alot? Check my frequentation stats http://my.bzflag.org/league/index.php?l ... fo&id=1916

note: I registered only two months ago. Lost in those stats are 1.8 years of playing.
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Post by Burned Account -CNG- »

im pretty sure that shows u the time u logged in or how many to the site.



in my opinion, 10 shot servers can be fun at a time, to "mess" around but it dosent have the "skillful" position ducati does, that being when you play ur bound to advance to a higher level. Although u probually like the server most veterian players(the ones i know) dont.

So find your way to ducati, gu or hepcat(when were playing first to 500 and theres a 4 hour time limit :) )
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Post by RPG »

Oh, I thought frequentation stats were how much you played.... oops. That's a good idea, BZFlag frequentation stats...

RPG goes off to ponder on how it could be coded
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Post by SportChick »

Well said, L4. Instead of avoiding them or calling them names, how about giving them a hand - a little instruction, friendly advice, whatever it takes. We welcome newbies at secretplace (but we don't tolerate foul language, cheating, etc.).
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Post by DTRemenak »

No offense, but a vets-only server is a cheap isolationist tactic. I don't know about the rest of you, but when I was new, a couple of experienced, awesome players saw me playing in my n00bishness and spent some of their valuable time with me to help me get better. I would never play on a vets-only server for just that reason...I feel that I have an obligation to pass on to the next round of new players that which was given to me. A new player should never leave the game frustrated and lonely. That said, what you do with your own server is (as always) up to you. Still, I think it would be a sad, sad day when the "vets" go isolate themselves from the rest of the community in thier little elitist stronghold and leave the new players to the trolls, cheaters, and sharks.
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Post by Soraya »

DTRemenak wrote:when I was new, a couple of experienced, awesome players saw me playing in my n00bishness and spent some of their valuable time with me to help me get better.
This makes me think how different bzflag is now than it was back then. Thank you, DTR, for bringing this back to me. When i was a noob, some of the experienced players spent their valuble time trying to help me get better. I myself have helped several ppl learn some tricks, and have been thanked for it. But i'm seeing now that a lot of ppl don't want to deal with the noobs and help them get better.
DTRemenak wrote:Still, I think it would be a sad, sad day when the "vets" go isolate themselves from the rest of the community in thier little elitist stronghold and leave the new players to the trolls, cheaters, and sharks.
The bolded part of this quote brings something else to mind. I've noticed that a lot of ppl, including myself, have been steriotyping new ppl. Yes, a lot of new players have an attitude and are outragiously rude, but also, a lot of them dont. I admit to having at least thought, if not said, that all noobs these days, have a major attitude problem; which isn't true.

Ok, so enough w/ the quoting stuff. I have a suggestion for a way to determine whether or not someone is experienced, if someone actally wants to go through w/ the "vet-only" server. But i don't want this to be for determining who's a vet or not, just who's less experienced and who's more experienced. In another game, Unreal Tournament 2004, there is a mod called RPG. You gain experience points and levels by enemies and doing certain things, like capturing the flag in ctf. After you gain a lvl, a greater # of pts are required to gain the next lvl. If someone were to create something similar for bz, it would help to define more clearly who is more experienced.
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Post by Glassjaw »

Soraya wrote: Ok, so enough w/ the quoting stuff. I have a suggestion for a way to determine whether or not someone is experienced, if someone actally wants to go through w/ the "vet-only" server. But i don't want this to be for determining who's a vet or not, just who's less experienced and who's more experienced. In another game, Unreal Tournament 2004, there is a mod called RPG. You gain experience points and levels by enemies and doing certain things, like capturing the flag in ctf. After you gain a lvl, a greater # of pts are required to gain the next lvl. If someone were to create something similar for bz, it would help to define more clearly who is more experienced.
It sounds really good in theory but won't this pose the same problem as with the bzstats? it's easy to cheat by playing against bots and stuff :? .
that experience system is just as reliable as the strenght index....
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Post by Soraya »

glassjaw wrote:
Soraya wrote: Ok, so enough w/ the quoting stuff. I have a suggestion for a way to determine whether or not someone is experienced, if someone actally wants to go through w/ the "vet-only" server. But i don't want this to be for determining who's a vet or not, just who's less experienced and who's more experienced. In another game, Unreal Tournament 2004, there is a mod called RPG. You gain experience points and levels by enemies and doing certain things, like capturing the flag in ctf. After you gain a lvl, a greater # of pts are required to gain the next lvl. If someone were to create something similar for bz, it would help to define more clearly who is more experienced.
It sounds really good in theory but won't this pose the same problem as with the bzstats? it's easy to cheat by playing against bots and stuff :? .
that experience system is just as reliable as the strenght index....
Hmmm, that's a good point... hadn't thought of that. There's got to be a way to diferentiate between players and bots. I can't think of anyway right now, but i'm sure eventually, someone will come up with something.
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Post by The Psycho Chicken »

This is a late response to your thread, but I was to play a few more battles after I had read it for the first time...

Do not try to organize what is better left to develop by itself.

If a global rating-system of some kind is really needed (and I am not yet decided), try to keep it chaotic and not mandatory for anyone to follow any rule based on the status of a player.

In analogy to the Purple Panzer's idea of medals, I developped what might be a suggestion for the player-ratings too. Let the community vote for an award. Not military medals, though. Publish honorable mentions on a web-site, that say something about the way, someone plays the game...
More like what the Romans granted to their generals, a "crown" for artfully rescuing the team from a desperate situation, one for murderous sense of humor and so on...

Make of that what you want-; allow players to your games who won at least one of those or anything worth a binary or.
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Post by dS »

CBG Implored:
Who decides who is "good"?

Why of course, I do.

I see you when you're sleeping,
I know when you're awake.
I know if you've been bad or good,
So be good for goodness sake!

Hmmm, good list is blank again this year. Note to self - Need more coal.

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Post by birdie »

if people who play allraedy quiet some time wouldnt help noobs/less skilled players, it would be lonely for some of them

i'm not saying i'm that good, but i have quiet some skill and i know the game, tactics, skills etc

i couldnt do that on my own, thats waaaay to hard(certainly on such short time)

note: thats why i want to thank: wizard, zongo and mikkel :wink: , they helped me the most with my skill and made me the person who i am now(whatever you may think about that person who i am now)

thats why if newbies ask me help, i mostly help them, give them hints, somethimes go allone with them on a server to give them hints, etc

a second note: i only help players who act nice, not the ones bitching around, and maybe thats why some people think the good skilled players dont want to help others

good skilled players and vets who dont want to help newbies are very selfish, but the ones i know arent selfish
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Post by Guest »

birdie wrote:if people who play allraedy quiet some time wouldnt help noobs/less skilled players, it would be lonely for some of them

i'm not saying i'm that good, but i have quiet some skill and i know the game, tactics, skills etc

i couldnt do that on my own, thats waaaay to hard(certainly on such short time)

note: thats why i want to thank: wizard, zongo and mikkel :wink: , they helped me the most with my skill and made me the person who i am now(whatever you may think about that person who i am now)

thats why if newbies ask me help, i mostly help them, give them hints, somethimes go allone with them on a server to give them hints, etc

a second note: i only help players who act nice, not the ones bitching around, and maybe thats why some people think the good skilled players dont want to help others

good skilled players and vets who dont want to help newbies are very selfish, but the ones i know arent selfish
I can think a few "vets" who wouldn't help out a n00b, but I agree there are lots that would and kudos to them! :)
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