Perhaps a new scoring system could be nice...

All things BZFlag - no [OT] here please

Do you think that the scoring system presented below in my post seem better?

Yes, that could be great!
8
67%
not at all!
4
33%
 
Total votes: 12

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Night Crawler
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Perhaps a new scoring system could be nice...

Post by Night Crawler » Thu Dec 15, 2005 12:55 pm

I have taught of something when reading the post of everybody about
the actual scoring system and teamwork for flag capture. Alot of player
are not interested in taking the enemie flag because the majority of the
time you die when you try to. Why does people dont whant to die in this
game? It's because it lower your score and you dont whant that other
player think you are not good at all... And it give you a bad reputation
because of your statistic...

So I think the actual scoring system sould be changed a little to make
people try harder to get the flag, because it's the meaning of that game.
Some player taught of something like getting points when you capture
the flag but it seem complicated for nothing, cause we didin't know how
much point it sould give to the flag carrier or if the whole team get points
or only the guys who touched the flag before it get to your main base...


I think I have a better idea... We sould have the same scoring system as
before(getting a point when killing and losing one when we die), but we
could have another line of point at the right of the killing score column.
This column could show the number of flag that we had capture since we
enter the game and the server could make a king of average between
you killing score and your flag score.

A player with -11 and 7 flag capture could be higher in the list of player
than a guy with 11 point and 0 flag capture. Their could be a
mathematical formula between the two score column.

Is this system seem good for BZFlag?
I think it would make people try harder to get the flag and it sould
encourage teamwork.
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in the darkness of the night, perhaps it's following you right now...''

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Post by joevano » Thu Dec 15, 2005 2:22 pm

Night Crawler said:
Alot of player are not interested in taking the enemie flag because the majority of the time you die when you try to. Why does people dont whant to die in this game? It's because it lower your score and you dont whant that other player think you are not good at all... And it give you a bad reputation because of your statistic...
I agree with you 100% on this point. Those who know me out at LaserMania know that I really take it on the chin with scoring. I RULE the bottom like no one else (ok, I can think of a few others but they are usually n00bs). But for me when the game is CTF, I play CTF. I do like all the snipers though, it makes it very challenging sometimes. If I get some kills along the way so be it. This type of system would reward that kind of game play. Not that I really care where I am on the list, I am confident enought with my ability or inability to have HUGE negative scores. But for many players that is not the case...

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Post by Mostly Harmless! » Thu Dec 15, 2005 3:48 pm

I think that CTF is a team sport. Even if you are just sniping, you greatly enhance the chance of survival in LaserMania. And even on other maps, you might stop some of the opposition, or distract them when an ST comes...
Therfore I belive agains Capturing the flag ba a player thing. It is perfectly good as is.

I never make stupid mistakes. Only very, very clever ones.
It is not the fall that kills you. It's the sudden stop at the end.
Always remember you are unique. Just like everybody else.

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Post by Ice Wewe » Thu Dec 15, 2005 8:02 pm

donny_baker wrote:Night Crawler said:
Alot of player are not interested in taking the enemie flag because the majority of the time you die when you try to. Why does people dont whant to die in this game? It's because it lower your score and you dont whant that other player think you are not good at all... And it give you a bad reputation because of your statistic...
I agree with you 100% on this point. Those who know me out at LaserMania know that I really take it on the chin with scoring. I RULE the bottom like no one else (ok, I can think of a few others but they are usually n00bs). But for me when the game is CTF, I play CTF. I do like all the snipers though, it makes it very challenging sometimes. If I get some kills along the way so be it. This type of system would reward that kind of game play. Not that I really care where I am on the list, I am confident enought with my ability or inability to have HUGE negative scores. But for many players that is not the case...
I debate that... You've seen me own the middle area, and the upper level, you can't say that you 'always' own.

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My opinion

Post by Cruel dog » Thu Dec 15, 2005 10:49 pm

Night Crawler said:
Alot of player
are not interested in taking the enemie flag because the majority of the
time you die when you try to. Why does people dont whant to die in this
game? It's because it lower your score and you dont whant that other
player think you are not good at all... And it give you a bad reputation
because of your statistic...
I agree with you at 100% on that. It's true... personnately, i am not good... and that would be good. So it would eliminates maniack negative scores... Good point Night. :)

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Post by Hannibal » Thu Dec 15, 2005 10:54 pm

Ice, he said he ruled the bottom like noone else..and where in that post did he say alwasys?

now, you can change how the score is sorted in the client.
Options>>GUI Settings>>Scoreboard Sort
Games don't make people violent, lag does.
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Post by Night Crawler » Thu Dec 15, 2005 10:59 pm

I just look in the score option and there is no way you can know the number of flag you bringed back. If we can see it, tell me where it is.
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Post by Ice Wewe » Fri Dec 16, 2005 12:24 am

Hannibal wrote:Ice, he said he ruled the bottom like noone else..and where in that post did he say alwasys?

now, you can change how the score is sorted in the client.
Options>>GUI Settings>>Scoreboard Sort
donny_baker wrote:I RULE the bottom like no one else (ok, I can think of a few others but they are usually n00bs). But for me when the game is CTF, I play CTF.

So Hannibal, you were saying? :D He said "no one else' that implies that that is always. (When he is playing, he can't own when he's sleeping :wink: )

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Post by Mostly Harmless! » Fri Dec 16, 2005 12:52 am

Ice Wewe
He said he ruled the bottom like nobody else. Except NOOBs. That leads us to belive that he is not good at keeping the bottom as he compares his ability to those who he thinks are new.

I never make stupid mistakes. Only very, very clever ones.
It is not the fall that kills you. It's the sudden stop at the end.
Always remember you are unique. Just like everybody else.

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Post by Ice Wewe » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:01 am

Mostly Harmless! wrote:Ice Wewe
He said he ruled the bottom like nobody else. Except NOOBs. That leads us to belive that he is not good at keeping the bottom as he compares his ability to those who he thinks are new.

Nah. He owns the bottem, if I'm somewhere else. :wink: Why don't you join the party? louman.bzflag.bz:5156 just about anytime in the afternoon, I'll be on there, maybe owning, maybe not.

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Post by Mostly Harmless! » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:12 am

Ice Wewe

I'm there during the afternoon once in a while. But I live in a different timezone from you, think.

I never make stupid mistakes. Only very, very clever ones.
It is not the fall that kills you. It's the sudden stop at the end.
Always remember you are unique. Just like everybody else.

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Post by Ice Wewe » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:15 am

Mostly Harmless! wrote:Ice Wewe

I'm there during the afternoon once in a while. But I live in a different timezone from you, think.
Right. What Time Zone you in? I'm in Eastern, aka GMT -0500.

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Post by Mostly Harmless! » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:20 am

Pacific, GMT-0800

I never make stupid mistakes. Only very, very clever ones.
It is not the fall that kills you. It's the sudden stop at the end.
Always remember you are unique. Just like everybody else.

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Post by Ice Wewe » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:21 am

Mostly Harmless! wrote:Pacific, GMT-0800

That would be why. So, when are you on, right about now? (8PM Eastern, 5PM Pacific.)

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Post by Hannibal » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:47 am

Night Crawler-
it doesnt show that, but the normalized score i find is better at determining the better players.
Games don't make people violent, lag does.
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Post by Night Crawler » Fri Dec 16, 2005 2:25 am

Do you really think that the best player is the one with the higher score or the guy with -10 and 10 flag captured? I think that we sould try my system in a beta version for fun. If people find this system better, perhaps we could keep it.

I will try to do a mathematical formula for this. Come back to see that post sunday(I will need the help of a math teacher) and you will see the formula(if I find one :? ).
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Post by Ice Wewe » Fri Dec 16, 2005 2:28 am

Night Crawler wrote:Do you really think that the best player is the one with the higher score or the guy with -10 and 10 flag captured? I think that we sould try my system in a beta version for fun. If people find this system better, perhaps we could keep it.

I will try to do a mathematical formula for this. Come back to see that post sunday(I will need the help of a math teacher) and you will see the formula(if I find one :? ).

Ok, you can write the code. :wink:

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Post by Hannibal » Fri Dec 16, 2005 2:40 am

I could, say, let another person on my team take the flag almost too the base, then TK said person, then grab the flag and cap it. my score would be -10, with 10 flag caps.
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Post by Night Crawler » Fri Dec 16, 2005 12:33 pm

Perhaps we could do somethink like ''If you tk our allie when he got the flag automaticaly kick you our of the game''. Or we could do something like ''If you tk your allie that got the flag, you can't transport it for 5 min.''
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Post by Ice Wewe » Fri Dec 16, 2005 1:23 pm

Night Crawler wrote:Perhaps we could do somethink like ''If you tk our allie when he got the flag automaticaly kick you our of the game''. Or we could do something like ''If you tk your allie that got the flag, you can't transport it for 5 min.''

Then you get into he said, she said (metaphorically). Also, it would have to be up to the server owner to say that. I'm not saying this wont work, I'm just saying that I wont write the code.

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Post by joevano » Fri Dec 16, 2005 3:54 pm

Some clarrification because Ice Wewe misinterpreted my remarks. I RULE the bottom of the score list. It is not uncommon to see me on LaserMania with a score of -30 or more. If you want to see if I am there you can look for the '@' but it is usually easier to look at who is in last place. That is where I usually am, but there are only a couple of players who get more captures than me :D (audi s4 and who, to name a few names)...

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Post by Hoplite » Fri Dec 16, 2005 4:20 pm

Hannibal wrote:I could, say, let another person on my team take the flag almost too the base, then TK said person, then grab the flag and cap it. my score would be -10, with 10 flag caps.
In most games you self-destruct when you TK, intentionally or not. So that's a non-issue.

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Post by Hannibal » Fri Dec 16, 2005 10:28 pm

its a server option.
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Post by RexFlex » Sun Dec 18, 2005 3:04 am

There's one behaviour I've noticed that the tk provisions don't cover. As a case example, a while back I was carrying the enemy flag on the final run to my team's base. I had carried it all the way from the enemy base, but was being chased by a persistant enemy tank. I passed a friendly tank that was just sitting there despite having the enemy tank easily within it's sight. I got shot by the enemy tank within a single jump of our base, and strangely the friendly "suddenly" saw opportunity to shoot the enemy tank before collecting the flag and making the final hop.

That selfish behaviour may not be common at the moment, but remember this was done without individual flag capture scoring. I could imagine how common it may become with that scoring given there is no TK involved.
"Hell, I'll kill a man in a fair fight, or if I think he's gonna start a fair fight, or if he bothers me, or if there's a woman, or if I'm gettin paid; mostly only when I'm gettin paid. But eating people alive, when does that get fun?"

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Post by Ice Wewe » Sun Dec 18, 2005 3:06 pm

RexFlex wrote:There's one behaviour I've noticed that the tk provisions don't cover. As a case example, a while back I was carrying the enemy flag on the final run to my team's base. I had carried it all the way from the enemy base, but was being chased by a persistant enemy tank. I passed a friendly tank that was just sitting there despite having the enemy tank easily within it's sight. I got shot by the enemy tank within a single jump of our base, and strangely the friendly "suddenly" saw opportunity to shoot the enemy tank before collecting the flag and making the final hop.

That selfish behaviour may not be common at the moment, but remember this was done without individual flag capture scoring. I could imagine how common it may become with that scoring given there is no TK involved.

What server was that on? I've had that happen many times before, that's why I just do a 180 jump over something and shoot his brains out!

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