Score for flag gets, passes and Caps

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peewee
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Score for flag gets, passes and Caps

Post by peewee » Thu Aug 14, 2008 8:19 pm

When playing missle war, I notice that there are those who kill, and those who play CTF (there is some overlap for some). There is no reward for playing CTF. In fact, you can fry a lot of personal points dealing with the flags. i fried a dozen points the other night trying to retrieve a *run* flag.

It would be nice for the server admin to be able to reward the people who work on passing, capping and recovering flags. It's not consistent across games, so it would have to be configurable.

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Post by joevano » Thu Aug 14, 2008 8:38 pm

Figure it out and code it up...
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AAA
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Post by AAA » Thu Aug 21, 2008 6:05 am

I thought there was a technical reason you can't change players scores? I heard on the client side, score is calculated based on MsgKilled and such, not the MsgScore that everyone else is updated with.

Anyways, good idea.
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L4m3r
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Post by L4m3r » Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:01 am

AAA wrote:I thought there was a technical reason you can't change players scores? I heard on the client side, score is calculated based on MsgKilled and such, not the MsgScore that everyone else is updated with.

Anyways, good idea.
in 2.0, yes, the client calculates its own score, so messing with it causes some state mismatching. 3.0 will allow player scores to be modified.

Score for flag capping or grabbing would be trivial to implement as a plugin in 3.0. Giving points for flag passing or recovering might be a bit more complex, however.
Optimism is just a milder alternative to denial.

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Post by joevano » Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:33 am

I see issues with awarding points for flag capping or grabbing, and I am one of the ones who plays CTF. I really could care less about my score. For flag grabbing, I see taking the flag moving it to a place your team controls and drop/grabbing the flag. That can be controlled in various ways through a plugin but it would have to be well thought out. If you give more than 1 or 2 points for a cap, then tking to cap starts to become a real issue. Some may find i beneficial to tk, and die for the opportunity to STEAL the cap from a teammate. I have thought about this quite a bit and I'm not sure awarding points for those things will be beneficial to the game.
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Post by diing for the team » Thu Aug 21, 2008 3:51 pm

I think it would not be so hard making the flag capping one but the passing and retrieving seems a bit harder, and if you only reward for capping you will get alot of idiotic flag hogs.

my thought is that if you want to make this do not make it without having flag capping and passing for part of score. also I think flag retrieving should not be rewarded because you are doing it to save yourself not your team generaly.

make the score like 1 point for grabbing and 4 points for capping if you do make it.

I believe this will fix the issue mentioned in http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=12949

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Steal the Bacon was a great game mode... I'm sorry it didn't catch on. Of course most people didn't understand how to play. Kinda like they think CTF is the same as FFA now.

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Post by joevano » Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:30 pm

diiing for the team wrote:I believe this will fix the issue mentioned in http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=12949

donny_baker
Steal the Bacon was a great game mode... I'm sorry it didn't catch on. Of course most people didn't understand how to play. Kinda like they think CTF is the same as FFA now.
Huh.. what issue are you talking about? Steal the Bacon has nothing to do with rewarding for capping.

Giving 4 points for a cap IS going to cause teamkilling to get the other teams flag, IMHO. Lets see, I could TK and have the chance to grab the other teams flag to cap for a net gain of 3, or not TK and get nothing. And what to you call a grab, if a grab is picking UP the other teams flag, my net gain for capping will still be 4 if I TK, because I'll get the point I lost from TKing for picking up the flag.
There is nothing worse than aggressive stupidity. -- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
"How many legs does a dog have if you call his tail a leg? Four. Calling a tail a leg doesn't make it a leg." -- Abraham Lincoln

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Post by diing for the team » Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:42 pm

that would be a dumb idea because you would die too

and i was talking bout the "Kinda like they think CTF is the same as FFA now. "

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Post by Tank 52 » Thu Aug 21, 2008 6:48 pm

hmmm,well ive been thinking for a while now,and instead of rewarding points for it,a plugin could be created to end the game after a preset number of captures is reached,then rejoin and do it again. OR maybe have the team members on the team that reached it get 10 points or something like that,that way the whole team is rewarded with points and if you tk to cap,you won't really get anything,you'll just end up losing a point from one of those 10 you wouldve got if your temmate captured it,but instead you'd get 9 for tking of course. (I mean if the team only needs one more to reach it) And lastly maybe just forget everything i just said and just make it so everyone on the team gets one point for every time their team captures the flag. Either one seems ok with me :)
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Post by joevano » Thu Aug 21, 2008 6:59 pm

Tank 52 wrote:hmmm,well ive been thinking for a while now,and instead of rewarding points for it,a plugin could be created to end the game after a preset number of captures is reached,then rejoin and do it again. OR maybe have the team members on the team that reached it get 10 points or something like that,that way the whole team is rewarded with points and if you tk to cap,you won't really get anything,you'll just end up losing a point from one of those 10 you wouldve got if your temmate captured it,but instead you'd get 9 for tking of course. (I mean if the team only needs one more to reach it) And lastly maybe just forget everything i just said and just make it so everyone on the team gets one point for every time their team captures the flag. Either one seems ok with me :)
Already used on Mofo's CTF server as well as others

diiing for the team wrote:that would be a dumb idea because you would die too

and i was talking bout the "Kinda like they think CTF is the same as FFA now. "
Not so dumb, they die you die... the flag is up for grabs, the race is on, and I have a chance at a lot of points for little effort. It would happen, and happen frequently... Guess you aren't as cynical as me, but I have seen the stupid things bzflaggers do get points. Cheap kills, noob genoing till they drive the other team off, etc... all in the name of getting the high score, instead of having good clean fun.
There is nothing worse than aggressive stupidity. -- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
"How many legs does a dog have if you call his tail a leg? Four. Calling a tail a leg doesn't make it a leg." -- Abraham Lincoln

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Post by khazhyk » Thu Aug 21, 2008 7:41 pm

/me has seen in other games that kill points are not rewarded, and deaths do not take away from a score in a CTF game. Rather, 1 point is given for each flag capture. This system works well.

Though in those games, no one will say "OMG WTF I CARRIED THE FLAG THE WHOLE WAY BUT DIED, AND DIDN"T GET POINTS???!?!?!11"

IMO, I think scoring for single players should be taken out for CTF games, it doesn't really add anything and distracts players from CTF.
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Post by joevano » Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:30 pm

Couldn't agree more, although I am afraid that without player scores getting people to a CTF would be a hard draw.
There is nothing worse than aggressive stupidity. -- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe
"How many legs does a dog have if you call his tail a leg? Four. Calling a tail a leg doesn't make it a leg." -- Abraham Lincoln

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Post by tw1sted » Thu Aug 21, 2008 11:03 pm

donny_baker wrote:although I am afraid that without player scores getting people to a CTF would be a hard draw.
I agree. People are to concerned with having a good personal score rather than having a good team score. I know a lot of new players to CTF leagues think that the personal score is what matters, even though it is a CTF league.

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Post by L4m3r » Fri Aug 22, 2008 6:39 am

Solving the TK problem would be relatively simple. Either turn off friendly fire, or impose a stiff penalty (more than you'd get from the cap) for teamkilling someone who's holding a flag.

Personally I think most CTF games would benefit from a lack of friendly fire...
Optimism is just a milder alternative to denial.

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Post by diing for the team » Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:23 pm

how about we make a seperate score.

not kills score capture score that way we can have a new way to brag while still keeping kill score kills only

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