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Team specialization - multiple chassis

Posted: Mon May 31, 2004 11:21 pm
by Workaphobia
This is a little out-there, but I thought it'd be neat.

Division of tasks and defense is an excellent element to CTF games, especially when the level allows for hiding places and bunkers. I think it would be even better if you could somehow customize your tank, to further specialize your role in combat. This could be either through a point system where you can chose to improve one of steering, speed, bullets, range, etc; or if you want to get even more complex perhaps some different kinds of tank models that would be visually distinct from the standard one. Imagine, a tank type that can jump where it’s disabled by default, or fit through small spaces (permanently Tiny), or only fire special weapons but with twice the efficiency... Of course, all of this would be optional on a server.

Advantages: More teamwork, players can chose what they're best at, adds depth to the game in terms of planning and counters, allows for some even more interesting rare effects
Disadvantages: Would raise all sorts of new balance questions, disorient current players until they adjust, perhaps lengthen the learning curve to the game, nullify some of the nuances of current maps

And I'm sure it'd be very difficult to implement, but like I said, it's out-there.

Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 1:58 am
by Guest
good idia work, here are some of my idias about stuff like that.
(server option to have on or off) ffa:blue power= blue short power= red short range gm.rogue power= half size SW and powers= double jump (only two jumps then you land and two more jumps etc).purple powers=abbility to jam all radars in a short range away.
(server option to have on or off) ctf:grn pwrs= tiny tank. red pwrs= 15 second cloaking and 15 second recharge for cloaking.
(server option to have on or off) Rabbit Chase:rabbit pwrs= double jump (only two jumps then you land and two more jumps etc). hunter pwrs= spread shot shotgun.
those are my idias for that. hope you like em'!
pop you later

Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 1:33 pm
by oblomov
Didn't I propose something similar in another thread?

Posted: Tue Jun 01, 2004 11:37 pm
by Workaphobia
Quite possible.. As my name implies, I'm a bit lazy, and didn't search for the topic ;)

Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 1:10 am
by elmer fudd
i dont like the specific power for each team but possibly have something where as n00bs they get to have more points to customize their tank.
Kind of like this:

You have certain settings that you can choose such as speed, manuverability, jump height, etc. When you start you have 10 points to customize. You can 2 increments on to speed, then you have 8 points left. But you could jump less, say 3 increments less than default, then you have 11 customize points. As you get More experienced you get less points and have to budget your points more, to balance the game.
:O How's that?

Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:25 am
by Workaphobia
Oblomov, I'm sorry, I didn't realize you were referring to the team power thread - I didn't associate your name with that topic. :)

I'm talking about a completely separate proposal. The only similarities are that you could have an innate ability to possess certain flag powers (Jump and Tiny for instance, like I mentioned before), but the points and powers would be independent of your teams and allies, or the current distribution of flags. In my idea, you would essentially pick and chose how you want to fight the battle and which chores you'll take on for the team - while to my understanding your idea is about grouping the team as a whole towards one end of the combat spectrum, rather than dividing everyone within the team into different abilities. :)

Elmer, that's basically the idea behind the points, budgeting it so that you are weak in some areas and strong in others. Though I think there would have to be a small resolution on the values. I mean, it gets difficult to balance the game when you give someone 100 points to spend, when the max might be 75 in an area for instance, and a single point difference alone essentially causes no noticeable effect. It's easier to handle giving out 5 points and a max of 3 or so for one particular attribute. Er, but you said 10, and that's a reasonable number too.

As for the initial amount you get, I don't think it'd really work to lower the amount depending on how long the person's been around - Besides the fact that longterm changes would require registration, it also encourages veterans to make new IDs to get more points on that account. I was thinking it would be totally constant, set by the server for everyone, equally. The only fair variation would be to make it a bonus for an excessive number of kills/captures, and even then only a little bonus, because it would make the strong stronger. If one guy dominates the game and gets his tank powered up in this sense, he could continue the cycle and perhaps become close to invincible.

I think it would be a bit cooler to use different tank bodies instead of points though, I only suggested budgeting because adding in new 3D models is sure to be difficult.

Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 4:01 am
by Guest
i like that idia, you can make better stuff on your tank if you get a bunch of points and spend them. good idia guys. ;)

Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 4:08 am
by rob1n
that would be would ppl save their stuff? in to local config file?

Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 9:44 am
by elmer fudd
no not local, like an account on the main server

Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 1:00 pm
by oblomov
Work: ok, I get the difference between your idea and mine: in your case, you have people within the same team with different capabilities, for different purposes. For example, one might have Velocity to act as a flag retriever, another might have shockwave to act as a flag defender, another could have IB to act as a sniper etc. It's a good idea, but in this case we would need better balancing between the flags. (e.g., Tiny is an extremely positive flag with little if any balance.)

Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:18 pm
by Death Barrel
hehe kinda like Grand Turismo, you custimize your tank with the more points you get... hehe :)

Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 3:10 pm
by rob1n
need for speed underground is better... :)

Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 8:02 pm
by Workaphobia
Actually I originally wasn't thinking of stored settings on the server - I figured the person would rebudget their points manually every time they logged in, with no extra benefit to registered users. But lil dog brings up a neat point. It would be interesting to make getting powerups/points a continuous process instead of having them disappear after a session and return to the same amount the next. Points could then be earned for good scores or even for participation on the server for an extended period of time, but once again the key problem is that newbies would be at an inherent disadvantage, as the strong get stronger and the weak are left behind.

It would sort of transform BZ into a semi-RPG where points are comparable to Experience, so the longer you have been around, the better your tank (or 'character') would become. This goes against one of BZ's greatest elements though: that I can just log in to a random server at a random time without any initializing steps or questions, without any disadvantages, and just play the game like anyone else.

From the coder's perspective, I think we can ignore this whole problem though, and stick to the idea of adding a point/powerup system in the first place without worrying about how the server distributes or redistributes them. Learn to crawl before walk, and all.

Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 8:14 pm
by Rebel Chik0rita
cool =)

i'd like to see this too . maybe combine it with RedRocks' "Risk" territorial type gamestyle too , heh .

BZflag as a Role-Playing-Game ...LoL that would be too awesome =D

i can only imagine how much coding it would take to do this =P
but then you could really market BZflag an make people pay to play it $bling$


Posted: Wed Jun 02, 2004 10:54 pm
by rob1n

sorta like Jedi Knight: Jedi Outcast have 30 points or smthing and u can get stuff like lightsaber throw, etc...