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status of [t] when typing

Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 9:59 pm
by michaelh20
I posted a patch on sourceforge versus the latest source that gives a player a status of [t] like [p] which is done for pausing. This should be completely backwards compatible and if a person doesn't have this modification, they do not see [t] and they can not be seen to be typing.

This will also fail possibly if a system has a less than 16 bit short.....

The more people that use this, the more useful a feature it will be

This could also potentially be expanded to more graphical things like changing the appearence of a tank that is typing or marking it in some way.

windows exe

This is the latest 1.7g1 source ....

Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 10:17 pm
by Spaceman Spiff
OoO... neat idea!!!!! :) This will keep people from excusing their deaths with "I was typing" when it isn't true. ;) *coughmartincough*

Posted: Fri Mar 21, 2003 11:23 pm
by JeffM
BZ is a game not a chat room, it's meant to be played. I personaly think that complaing about geting killed while typing is kinda lame. You should kow that it will happen when you enter the game ( you know all the bullets wizzing around).

This may actualy make people look to kill you when you are typing. since they know you may more then likely will not be able to respond.

I would think that if you want to type something big, then you you should pause.

Just my $0.02

Posted: Sat Mar 22, 2003 3:08 am
by Spaceman Spiff
That's fine....... BUT (you knew that was coming, huh? ;)) I always get accused of being a "pauser" when I pause (Yes, even if I have ST and I am in a secret hiding spot). :( You are probabily right Patlabor.. I wasn't thinking of it that way. How about a separate button for a "typing break"??? You could have the same appearance as being paused, and couldn't be killed, but it would say [t] instead of [p]. Would that work???? :)

Posted: Sat Mar 22, 2003 5:42 am
by orchid
then all i need to do is pretend to type and hit that pause/typing key to avoid being shot!

wasnt the 5 second coundown on pausing implemented for that reason? pausing to avoid being shot? What was that guys name "somthing the pauser" who used to go round doing that all the time? That 5 sec thing pretty much ended his career :)

Anyway you should be able to chat on irc, and on yahoo and chat in bz while still shooting tanks...multitasking isnt it? :wink:

Posted: Sat Mar 22, 2003 8:02 am
by Spaceman Spiff
I didn't mean an instant pause. :roll: Hehehehehe. I mean just a different pause status... that way people can't call me a "pauser" anymore.

I have yet to break the habbit of chatting in the middle of spin jumping battles and milti-player crossfire, but hey... what's the fun in typing when you're sitting still?!?! ;)

As for Yahoo and IRC... they lag me if I leave them on during a BZ game. LoL! (Kidding.) There should be more nice girls like you in the BZ community. You give it some life! :bow:

Posted: Sat Mar 22, 2003 9:58 am
by purple_cow
oofa, one of my many pet peeves (gee, i should lighten up).

i don't really feel that anyone should whine "i was typing"

i learned fairly early on how to control when and how i typed messages to people, as i tend to be fairly chatty when i'm logged in (speaking of which, i ought to play, its been months). Getting mad at an opponent because they shot you is silly, especially if it was your own damn fault for letting them get close while you were typing :)

Posted: Sat Mar 22, 2003 5:57 pm
by Spaceman Spiff
The real issue for me isn't just chatting.. it's generally administrating. I'll give you a real example of a situation that I have been in.

I was on Turkey one night and I was just playing along and having a good time when a cheater came on. He started flying around with a SW, going through buildings, etc. So, I paused and banned him.. and everyone started calling me a pauser! I explained the problem and they still wouldn't be quiet about it. THEN, when I un-paused three or four people were waiting and they all shot at me (killing me and themselves).

Now.. is that reason enough to have a pausing status??? I don't need to pause to chat, I can do that while I frag... but reading an offender's IP and trying to retype it into a /ban command while in a battle is not so easy. And being accused of pausing in the middle of a battle is even more annoying!

Posted: Sat Mar 22, 2003 8:13 pm
by michaelh20
It's only meant as an indicator and people can take what they like from it, it doesn't mean you can't shoot the person who's typing, but perhaps you at least *know* if they are. I think it's a bit annoying myself to shoot someone and then realize they were typing. As for it not being a chatroom, well, it is kind of.

Posted: Sun Mar 23, 2003 3:41 am
by Spaceman Spiff
Heh. How about a [a] (administrating) sign for admins? One that only people logged in as admins can use???

Posted: Sun Mar 23, 2003 6:10 pm
by JeffM
I think that would be very usefull. Then you could know who was an admin, and if you were an admin, if somone else had it you could know they admined too.

Posted: Wed Mar 26, 2003 4:10 am
by Dervish
I'd agree a little with Patlabor and a little with Spiff on this one. :)

I think it's a wicked idea, michaelh, and I'd encourage developers to work on something similar to this. Here's the strengths and weakness of this that I see.

The [t] status...
  • It may encourage some players to strike when they otherwise wouldn't. Ex: two players are facing off, and one is going to type a message while waiting for the other to make a move. The player not typing may see this [t] status and attack.
  • Doomed players may decide to hit "n" just so they can whine they were typing when destroyed. Some people will just take advantage of this.
  • Others will take advantage of this by pressing "n" and never leaving the message prompt.
  • This feature is great for friendly games where players trust each other and respect each other enough to wait for someone to finish a message before ambushing them.
  • When someone mentions a tank caught them off guard when typing, a [t] status would at least stop the typicaly responses, "suuuurrre you were".
  • Would this extra point in sending a bit cause any more lag? My guess is no, but you can never tell with the way BZFlag's networking is coded. ;)
Overall I think it's a great idea, but should be something that is toggled by the user instead of automatically enabled or toggled by the server. This way the ones who don't want others to know when they're typing can disable it and the ones who do can.

I don't think it should change the tank's graphic, just a status indicator.

Rules for Typing Pause

Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2003 6:43 am
by wiz
If a special typing pause were implemented, the following rules could be applied to it:

- You maintain your flag and score, but you disappear from the radar/playing field upon entering typing pause (with the normal 5 second delay)
- When you unpause, you pseudo-respawn in a new location. When this happens, you are not yet back in the game and you still don't show up on radar. In this state you can spin around to verify that the immediate area is clear.
- Upon verifying that it is "safe", you initiate the "full" respawn. Once you fully respawn, you have a 5 second (3 second?) delay before your weapons are operational again. Other than that, you are fully mobile.

Come to think of it, this might be something that would work for regular pauses too. I can't tell you how frustrating it is to go to my favorite hunting grounds (i.e., camping spot) and find that someone is paused there. If I leave, then I've let that person "close off" a good location. If I stay, I have little choice but to kill them after they unpause (although I usually give a few seconds for them to re-orient themselves). Of course I am then roundly criticized for "waiting for them" when in reality I did nothing of the sort - they just picked a bad place to pause.


Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2003 3:23 am
by michaelh20
I hadn't thought of making an option of wether to reveal typing or not.. that's an interesting idea. As for lag, there's 16bits worth of status information (at least in theory) that's sent in every player update message and 8 of them are currently used. Hence there's 8 bits unused (one of which I use here) and it doesn't cost anything at all in terms of lag.

In terms of the [t] vs. the graphic, you have to have the scoreboard up to realize someone is typing, and being new to OGL, I hand coded the 3dT -- so it was a learning experience. There's an option as I have it written now to turn off the 3dT, so it shouldn't be an issue.

typing whining

Posted: Mon Apr 28, 2003 12:35 pm
by Guest
will this really be effective?

as for people unpausing and incurring instant death...........after tracking a GM or SW or OO or L around the board with ST and just getting to the point where i can attack.......and then they pause............yes i am going to stick around and for typing..........IMO, typing is a risk, whether there is a little T there or not.......a shot can be on the way when the person starts typing.......

although interesting for friendly games with a low number of people......on a busy server......IMO, it will not be effective....