Missile War - Need player thoughts

General talk about the map making process.
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ducatiwannabe
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Missile War - Need player thoughts

Post by ducatiwannabe » Wed Jun 27, 2007 2:24 pm

Alright, I'm curious if everybody who plays on the Missile War map is content with its current state or if they'd like to see some major (or minor) revamping done.

Is the map good how it is? If you could add (or even remove) something what would it be? (Please, don't ask me to take the pyramids out and return them to normal).

Just wanting some player's opinions here. Not saying anything is changing, not saying it isn't.

Thanks!

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Post by red comander » Wed Jun 27, 2007 4:21 pm

You should take out the thingey in the middle and make like a building.
Also you should make the walls between the base smaller in leight and add some trees. :D

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Post by macsforme » Wed Jun 27, 2007 8:07 pm

Inside the fortresses, there's a platform with SW flags on one side and WG flags on the other. However, it is inconsitent which flags are on which side base-to-base. Putting them on consitent sides (for instance, WG on the right, SW on the left) would help the attackers plan their attack better. :-)

Aside from that... hmmm... CTF play seems to be extremely difficult, and requires a real team effort (and is sometimes still impossible if the defending team is well-equipped with the right flags). Not saying that's a bad thing, but it would be cool if something were done to encourage CTF play. Fewer missiles perhaps... or more places for cover from them, both inside and outside the base.

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Post by Grace F » Wed Jun 27, 2007 9:50 pm

I'm not sure if this is the case but, a while ago the drive through pyras allowed you to see some tanks inside them. Red was visible which made it bad if you had ST, where on the other hand a Blue tank remains hidden. Maybe jujst adding textures to the Pyras can help this.
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Post by Lan » Thu Jun 28, 2007 6:38 am

I play on your map quite frequently (either you or Mofo, whichever has significantly more players), and when I first read your post I thought of all the things that annoy me about the map. However, these are all things related to strategy, rather than truly poor map design, therefore it is tough to thing of things wrong with the map.

The only truly poorly designed part of the map are whatever causes Laser to ricochet off the teleporters in the towers. I am unsure if this is truly a problem, and if so, if it can be solved without sacrificing gameplay, but it seems I can never shoot a camper in the tower that is 180 degrees from my tower without killing myself. It seems as if a teleporter is behind the camper, yet somehow I die too.

Thats all I can think of. Great map, and a great server! Keep it up is all I can really emphasize!

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Post by The Frog Master » Thu Jun 28, 2007 11:16 am

Awsome map, I think it could have a bit of editing done, not that I exactly know what, maybe something in the middle? The rings are nice and all, but it would be good to see something new.

Definitely one of the best servers around.

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Post by Macrosoft » Thu Jun 28, 2007 4:03 pm

Lan wrote:The only truly poorly designed part of the map are whatever causes Laser to ricochet off the teleporters in the towers.
Lan: lasers dont rico off teleporters, the shot gets teleported, ricochets off the wall in the tower, and goes back through the teleporter again, possibly hitting someone(like you). this is normal, not an error. just be careful when you play with weapons that have rico + very long range.
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Post by TD-Linux » Sat Jun 30, 2007 8:35 pm

Macrosoft wrote:
Lan wrote:The only truly poorly designed part of the map are whatever causes Laser to ricochet off the teleporters in the towers.
Lan: lasers dont rico off teleporters, the shot gets teleported, ricochets off the wall in the tower, and goes back through the teleporter again, possibly hitting someone(like you). this is normal, not an error. just be careful when you play with weapons that have rico + very long range.
I think he meant when you are in a tower, and try to shoot someone in another tower. It would be nice to fix the offending object in the base so the laser doesn't come back up the tower and to the source.

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Post by Ordep » Sat Jun 30, 2007 9:49 pm

TD-Linux wrote:
Macrosoft wrote:
Lan wrote:The only truly poorly designed part of the map are whatever causes Laser to ricochet off the teleporters in the towers.
Lan: lasers dont rico off teleporters, the shot gets teleported, ricochets off the wall in the tower, and goes back through the teleporter again, possibly hitting someone(like you). this is normal, not an error. just be careful when you play with weapons that have rico + very long range.
I think he meant when you are in a tower, and try to shoot someone in another tower. It would be nice to fix the offending object in the base so the laser doesn't come back up the tower and to the source.
Well... If you shoot a little bit on a diagonal line it's possible not to shoot yourself. However this takes time to aim and the other player may run away.
But most of times I am able to kill them. So I dont believe this is much of a problem. Just aim well and you won't get killed. :wink:

About any change: I would really enjoy see something new on the middle! :roll:
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Post by ducatiwannabe » Mon Jul 02, 2007 3:55 am

Well... If you shoot a little bit on a diagonal line it's possible not to shoot yourself. However this takes time to aim and the other player may run away.
You're absolutely right. And if he runs away, he's not in the tower being pesky anymore is he? :)

I'll see if I can come up with something for the middle. Thanks for your thoughts, all!

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Post by lodxcol » Mon Jul 02, 2007 4:11 am

I had thought the laser length had been shortened, so as to not cause the ricocheting in the towers. I could be wrong about it being shortened, I'll have to check.

Other than that, I do believe it's one of the best maps around, and I enjoy maintaining it with tadd.

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Post by flight » Tue Jul 10, 2007 3:26 am

many people said they would like to see something added in the middle. personally i really like the arcs. maybe there is a way of getting the best of both worlds by adding a platform above the arcs. something you can get to through a teleporter maybe. what addvantages the new platform will have i don't know, i'll leave that up to you. maybe a GM place. one way i was thinking of getting to the platform is from the upper corner of ever base there are two "prongs" that stick out. i'm not really sure what those are there for but you could continue those out connecting it to the added middle platform in the center. once again be creative with the center not just a platform but ... well i'll leave it up to you :P.

one thing i think is anoying however is the diffuse on the bases. maybe turn down the brightness of the color. sometimes i quit playing just cause my eyes can't handle it any more. :P

other than that i love the map!!

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Missilewar play

Post by The Purple Panzer » Tue Jul 17, 2007 6:59 pm

For reasons I can't quite express, I've really enjoyed playing on the map recently, most of the time I'm playing BZFlag. I've slowed down a little, partly because I'm bored with it (this isn't a reflection on the map, I'd be the same way on pretty much any other map I've spent as much time with).

One strategy I use to avoid boredom is to try to play any flag I get as optimally as possible, rather than to try to run up points or steal flags. It works - and makes me think that there might be several sorts of 'channels of play' you might want to encourage in the map. The forts are great for a style of play when you get into another team's, or when you're trying to defend your own - and there are similar other distinct styles to playing other parts of the map as well. Going for central Geno is one such example, though I swear at the Thief flags hiding it, and with lots of players someone is sure to have SB and get you quickly.

Note though that most players (especially when there are lots of players) stay in their forts, effectively using very little of the board. It might be worthwhile adding some strongholds (ideally requiring cooperation) elsewhere on the board, so that more of the board gets used. Maybe a vertical escape in some way, to a higher playing area somewhat independent of the regular field.

It'd be great to encourage people to get out more, by having safe havens or especially desirable flags out in known locations. While there is probably an opportunity in the center, the areas between forts (midway) might be worth extending. Then a team could gather there to attack a base, or position support forces there.

I also feel that life is so short on the open field that teams across the center from each other rarely go after each others' flags - it's usually an adjacent fort that tries this. Maybe a 'jumpblock' (physics driver) that let you get diagonally most of the way across the map somewhat safely might be good, to encourage a more even/uniform threat from opposition teams.

I love laser sniping from the 'point' of a fort, but I often restrict myself to one shot - it's good training, especially when ST'd tanks go for the center, and you have to react quickly and accurately. I wouldn't discourage this sort of thing, but the laser can be pretty intrusive diagonally across the map - maybe not such a bad thing, as people hang out with GM's there, etc., so perhaps overall good balance is achieved.

Another idea: create 5 or 6 maps that are very subtle variations of this one, and rotate them. Then there'd almost always be a 'new' feel to the server, but it'd be familiar enough that people wouldn't mind.

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Re: Missilewar play

Post by macsforme » Tue Jul 17, 2007 7:26 pm

The Purple Panzer wrote:Note though that most players (especially when there are lots of players) stay in their forts, effectively using very little of the board. It might be worthwhile adding some strongholds (ideally requiring cooperation) elsewhere on the board, so that more of the board gets used. Maybe a vertical escape in some way, to a higher playing area somewhat independent of the regular field.
I agree... a good idea. Perhaps the appropriate placement of teleporters between them, so that players don't always have to go out into the open, would also be appropriate.

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