Were are all the skilled players in public ?

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io
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Were are all the skilled players in public ?

Post by io » Wed May 14, 2008 8:44 pm

Okay, how do i Start with it?.
The Best thing would be if i explain something before using the words:
(That no one (hopefully) missunderstands me)

Ok: Public is a server, were you do not need to be in a spezial group to play on it.
A few exampels: Mofo, Norang, The Two Castles.
League means to me a kinda "closed" Group. (only open to players that are "known"). (I hope again that you do not missunderstand me in this point.)

What i notice, noticed recently is that Gamers, who reached a Level of skill tend to drift of to leagues.
The reasons: (in my point of view)

1. They like the compative more then the "normal" playing.
2. They are anoyed of the public because they are too good.
3. There are not enough maps with a decent play quality. (Sorry to say that, but most maps out there currently are just crap).

This wouldn't be a bad thing, if there would be enough good players that would stay in public.
(Sure Bzflag is compativ but in leauges it is different). I like the public, but i m anoyed of the currently state of players in public.

Another thing is that there are always the same maps on top of the list...

Now i just want to know, what you think about that :)

Hopefully you understand what i want to say, if you got questoins feel free to ask..
Marzipan


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Post by macsforme » Wed May 14, 2008 9:05 pm

Some maps are better than others and do tend to attract the better players, like you said. The maps hosted by Silvercat, such as Overlord and Babel, used to attract lots of really good players every evening. On the other hand, leagues provide a whole different mentality of playing. You play the same map all the time, you play against really good players, and you play with the same people on your team, so you learn their strengths and weaknesses. IMHO that can't be duplicated by public servers, although a good FFA or CTF game is always lots of fun if your teammates are working with you.

That said, give league play a whirl... it's a whole different experience, and it's lots of fun!

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Post by silver surfer » Wed May 14, 2008 10:09 pm

I'd say people join leagues because they are more fun... Theres no cheaters... usually... They have slightly better players... or much more better players and less rooky players...

i havnt been on bzflag in a 2 weeks... guess why... nobodys putting up new maps... that are acually fun... and its so boring observing if ur not talking to someone... so i just havnt been getting on... but one thing is everyone gets ideas from other maps... so when the new maps come out they look exactly like the others!... so we need some original maps... the one im currently making i dont think i seen anything like it... so it'll be a change... a NEW map! acually the only thing that may be the idea of the tunnels... constitution did some tunnels... but i didnt use his...

constitution... why isnt that map up anymore?... the map was fun...

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Post by io » Wed May 14, 2008 10:39 pm

Constituion:

If i would like to play on one map over and over again, i would join a league.
But that is not the thing i want :).

I don't want to get fpretty prefect in hix. I don't see a reason, i don't have fun with it. Mabey i m alone with that, but i thought i write my thoughts here :)

Silver Surfer:

Wow, you did turn out your post to an advertise for your map, congratz ;)
Marzipan


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We dance because we can not fly

Legalize it!

I created a map, i just can't remeber because i were high.


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Post by ducktape » Wed May 14, 2008 10:45 pm

Marzipan: When you say "League means to me a kinda "closed" Group. (only open to players that are "known"). (I hope again that you do not missunderstand me in this point.) " Thats not fully true. Leagues are very happy to have newbs and the like, just not if they have the attitude that they dont want to learn. So leagues are very open to new players.
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Post by F687/s » Thu May 15, 2008 1:06 pm

> I'd say people join leagues because they are more fun... Theres no cheaters... usually... They have
> slightly better players... or much more better players and less rooky players...


Uh, slightly better players? When I joined GU, I thought I was pretty good (being able to score in the positive double digits frequently). However, that was soon eliminated once I saw people executing perfect strafe jumps against me. And that was on the public GU server! Most of the people I meet in leagues are ones who have attained wizardry in that map (or map-style, like Ducati). And many of those players can easily adapt that play-style to similar maps.

Other things aside, the reason there aren't very many good players on the public servers is because the number of bad players dilutes them quite well.

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Post by Tank 52 » Thu May 15, 2008 11:25 pm

Well,marz i actually kinda do that league thing too,but mainly for the fact that you get really stressed and competitive during official matches,it kind of offers me a kind of adreniline run i USUALLY don't get at public servers,but i still do go to them sometimes...
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Post by macsforme » Thu May 15, 2008 11:29 pm

silver surfer wrote:i havnt been on bzflag in a 2 weeks... guess why... nobodys putting up new maps... that are acually fun... and its so boring observing if ur not talking to someone... so i just havnt been getting on...
So you need a continual stream of new maps to grab your interest? For me (and many others I know), playing a well-designed map regularly helps me learn all its intricacies and get better at it, and that of itself is a lot of the fun. A lot of maps (like Hix) have a ton of intricacies that aren't immediately apparent to the eye.
silver surfer wrote:acually the only thing that may be the idea of the tunnels... constitution did some tunnels... but i didnt use his...

constitution... why isnt that map up anymore?... the map was fun...
I hosted Tunnels myself for a while, and then it was hosted by Grover/lodxcol/Tadd, but it didn't prove popular. Frankly, I don't think it was all that great of a map.

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Re: Were are all the skilled players in public ?

Post by Cpl Foggy Dewhurst » Tue Jun 10, 2008 11:37 am

Marzipan wrote:Okay, how do i Start with it?.
The Best thing would be if i explain something before using the words:
(That no one (hopefully) missunderstands me)

Ok: Public is a server, were you do not need to be in a spezial group to play on it.
A few exampels: Mofo, Norang, The Two Castles.
League means to me a kinda "closed" Group. (only open to players that are "known"). (I hope again that you do not missunderstand me in this point.)

What i notice, noticed recently is that Gamers, who reached a Level of skill tend to drift of to leagues.
The reasons: (in my point of view)

1. They like the compative more then the "normal" playing.
2. They are anoyed of the public because they are too good.
3. There are not enough maps with a decent play quality. (Sorry to say that, but most maps out there currently are just crap).

This wouldn't be a bad thing, if there would be enough good players that would stay in public.
(Sure Bzflag is compativ but in leauges it is different). I like the public, but i m anoyed of the currently state of players in public.

Another thing is that there are always the same maps on top of the list...

Now i just want to know, what you think about that :)

Hopefully you understand what i want to say, if you got questoins feel free to ask..
You was never new then? You downloaded it, installed it, and was automatically a professional player?

Tell me, where do you suggest all the new people to go? Or in your words, "the people who aren't good enough for you to play with" to go?

Perhaps BZFlag should ban any new user to join? Then all the players you do deem superior enough, fellow people who were never new and never had to learn, will grow older, grow border, eventually leave as they get girlfriends, wives, jobs, examinations at college or university or what ever..... then it'll just be you, on your own, as you didn't like new people in public, which meant they had nowhere to learn how to play.

No inexperienced players = eventually no experienced players. Think about it.

By the way, you should really type with both hands instead of shaking about.
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Cheerio!

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Post by Cj_ » Sun Jun 15, 2008 6:51 pm

I dont play leagues because of time constraints... I cant dedicate enough time to be an asset. So I wander through the public maps...

I prefer different maps for different style of playing... I usually only haunt a few maps because I dont like the random shoot maps, prefer maps that require some sort of strategy.

I do like the new players, I have met some great people. They tend to be more enthusiastic and energetic in their playing.

1 thing I will say, if you like a map... hang out, pretty soon a pick-up game will start. I do miss playing with/against a lot of the people who are probably on league servers.

My2¢

Cj

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Post by leviathan » Fri Aug 15, 2008 10:31 am

when i first come into the duc league it felt like i joined a completely new game. the league experience is in my opinion far superior to public playing.

the most important reason for that is of course the interaction with other players. and this is a large subject since i count making friends and developing tactics to that. this also includes the "making-a-name" thing, which is an important factor for motivation i believe.

another point is, as already mentioned, the cheating. we have less cheating in leagues. it also FEELS like there are less accusations and misbehavior in leagues. this might be due to the name-thingy i mentioned and the fact that you cant switch your callsign very easy due to registration and spawn lists.

but i guess the points you already stated in your first post are true either..

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Post by Knox » Sat Aug 16, 2008 9:32 pm

BzF is a popular game game.. More and more new players are coming and those "new players dont start in leagues. How could they? They dont even know the leagues: GU, ducati, pillbox, soccer. So, the new player play on "public" server. And as everybody who starts playing a new game, they are bad! If now comes a good player, he thinks: "Ugh, just noobs here.. i better play league today." explanation enough?

Btw.: i dont like flags, thats because i dont play public servers with superflags. I really like badgerking, thats the only server that i play that have superflags and zaphods servers!
What if you slept? And what if, in your sleep, you dreamed? And what if in your dream, you went to heaven and there plucked a strange and beautiful flower? And what if, when you awoke, you had the flower in your hand? Ah, what then? - Coleridge; English philosopher

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Post by Monster » Mon Sep 29, 2008 10:37 am

"What i notice, noticed recently is that Gamers, who reached a Level of skill tend to drift of to leagues."
The same happened to me. For me the reason is just the comunication. When you're playing at the Hix map (official server or public) there are always people willing to talk to you and you probably know them. So you can have a good conversation or continue one. I really like to play on Badgerkings areals when Green Manalishi or someone else who isn't too shy or just not in the mood to talk is there. Nowoadays a huge part of what makes bzf fun to me is the comunity and all the funny human beings that I meet. Unfortunately that's something most public servers can't give to me. I like a map not because of the "map" but because of the players. Therefore i'll mainly stay with Hix:)
wfg M.

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Post by Grace F » Mon Sep 29, 2008 10:59 am

Monster wrote:I like a map not because of the "map" but because of the players. Therefore i'll mainly stay with Hix:)
That's why I continue to stay. :)

Hix, being the small community it is, gives the players a chance to get to know eachother. It's good that way, however, it's bad in a sense that you can get annoyed of eachother just as quick. :)
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Post by Green Manalishi » Mon Sep 29, 2008 12:03 pm

Monster wrote:I really like to play on Badgerkings areals when Green Manalishi or someone else who isn't too shy or just not in the mood to talk is there. Nowoadays a huge part of what makes bzf fun to me is the comunity and all the funny human beings that I meet. Unfortunately that's something most public servers can't give to me. I like a map not because of the "map" but because of the players. Therefore i'll mainly stay with Hix:)
wfg M.
hey ho, that's a moral boost, thanks. :) you need to show up more on badger's though. the server's up and running (and kicking) again after a 2 week break. i think we really have become a good public server both in terms of having a fair amount of skilled players, some of whom (grace, hobo, boresnake a.o.) are also league players, and being a community whose regulars know each other since a long time and new cool people fit in quickly.. i also get bored easily on a map when no one's talking. if my attempts to liven it up (typically by provocative comments or whining 8)) fail, i just leave the server.

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Post by Tank 52 » Mon Sep 29, 2008 7:04 pm

Hey green,when you said fail and leave the server,did you mean that time me you and a couple others were at ahs's practice server a couple weeks ago and i kept killing you and you said you had to go....was that what you were reffering to? :wink:
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Post by trainee » Tue Sep 30, 2008 1:21 am

Green:

If you were to dress in public in similar attire to that in your avatar, that would liven things up very nicely. :shock:

"Cum on," Green, "feel the noize." :slick:

NB: BTW, "You have something that belongs to me." :wink:

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Post by Green Manalishi » Tue Sep 30, 2008 8:44 am

Tank 52 wrote:Hey green,when you said fail and leave the server,did you mean that time me you and a couple others were at ahs's practice server a couple weeks ago and i kept killing you and you said you had to go....was that what you were reffering to? :wink:
hey tank, i don't know what you're talking about. you must have confused me with someone. :roll: why would a bz master like me play on a practice server anyway? makes no sense. :slick:
boresnake wrote:Green:
If you were to dress in public in similar attire to that in your avatar, that would liven things up very nicely. :shock:
"Cum on," Green, "feel the noize." :slick:
NB: BTW, "You have something that belongs to me." :wink:
lol you can't believe in what kind of attires i'm playing the game. good thing i'm in the tank and nobody sees me. :P
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you know, that thing belongs to me by divine right and i'm always on the battlefield to (re)claim it.. 8)

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Post by io » Tue Sep 30, 2008 10:35 am

well... i fergot that post for some time :oops:

I read throw it carefully and here are my answers:
You was never new then? You downloaded it, installed it, and was automatically a professional player?
Yeah, i were new, i installed the game, and no i weren't a professional. But i never said that.
Tell me, where do you suggest all the new people to go? Or in your words, "the people who aren't good enough for you to play with" to go?
You missunderstood me. this wasn't a attack on the new players. It was kinda an attack to the "good" players, who should play more in public. Not the bad players leave.
Perhaps BZFlag should ban any new user to join? Then all the players you do deem superior enough, fellow people who were never new and never had to learn, will grow older, grow border, eventually leave as they get girlfriends, wives, jobs, examinations at college or university or what ever..... then it'll just be you, on your own, as you didn't like new people in public, which meant they had nowhere to learn how to play.
See above, i will not comment that...
No inexperienced players = eventually no experienced players. Think about it.
Thought about it and agreed
By the way, you should really type with both hands instead of shaking about.
...

Ok, i gave it a thought again. Another try to explain what i mean:

Mabey i repeat myself. But im speaking about players who have been active on the public sector and now seem to play in leagues only now.

(For what reason however)

What if you give public a try again. :) Mabey there would be more maps again.[/quote]
Marzipan


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We dance because we can not fly

Legalize it!

I created a map, i just can't remeber because i were high.


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Post by Monster » Wed Oct 01, 2008 11:15 am

you need to show up more on badger's though
I will Green, I will :wink:

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Post by zaphod » Wed Oct 22, 2008 1:41 pm

well ... i like both ::: public and league gaming!
i just love this game with all its features and variety!!! (HUGE thanks to the dev-team!!!)
it is obvious that the maps on top of the listing are popular, but for my personal taste ::: i don't like them too much or the lag is so enormous that hitting an enemy is just pure luck!
so more often i find myself with the gu league on hix map and the level of the players is in my opinion 3 steps higher then on public-style! impressive what some of the gu-league players are able to do with their mouse/keyboard!!!
also the fact of knowing many gu-players and being part of an active and good team is another kind of challenge to this game and underlines what Monster wrote earlier: its most about players!
also there is at anytime some gu-player on any of the most hosted maps (i guess it is the hix map?!).
the whole league thing gives it a wider fun range with the team spirit and trying to climb up the ladder of rating against other teams, while discussing tactics and approaches with your mates. and that is very different to the public-style of going out that field and shot others for more points!
but thats a lot of fun too!!! i like playing on different maps ::: i could not play over and over the same map day after day ... but playing the gu-league improved my skills and gave me that new aspect of bzflag!
but i'm willing and just hoping for other new&smart&better maps to be on top of the listing to play more often public style!!!
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